New hire seeking ORD Jr FO B737 v A320 advice
02-01-2016, 12:09 PM
#31
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2010
Position: EWR 777 Captain
Posts: 1,715
Originally Posted by bkC130
Thanks for all the great information folks. I'm warming up to the idea of STL-EWR and STL-LGA commutes actually being easier than STL-ORD....an extra hour+ each way but likely full-size commuter-friendly WN birds with perhaps fewer overall commuters?
I've been bouncing back and forth on 320 vs 737 still. An EWR 320 FO new hire bud who only hit IOE in late October just notched his first hard line for Feb and is a crazy ~80 of 155 (~55%) base seniority already, however at his overall company seniority while he'd be about 10-20% lower EWR 737 seniority he'd also be holding a line there as I looked at that Feb bid package. Looking at the EWR 737 lines vs. EWR 320, there are some rougher 737 redeyes and transcons (5-6 hr blocks) but guppy books almost 10 more hours (~86 vs. 76) and 20-40 block hours of international time...that's an extra $1,000.mo before dinner/bar tabs. The standard EWR 320 trips look like 3-days with 2-hops that average closer to 2-3 hour flights each and overnight in smaller cities....looks like a decidedly "easier" flying schedule than the 737 and a couple more days off too.
I'm thinking the other variable is how long I'd want to remain in either narrowbody out of the gate. I think there will perhaps be stronger movement in the 320 during 2016 with all the new A319s delivering, but if I'm thinking 2-3 years the 737 could overtake the bus when all the 2017 -700 deliveries begin? Am i right that the 2 x -900s (Jan & Feb) are the only guppy fleet gains for the rest of 2016? If we don't move to a domicile in Summer '17, I definitely won't vacancy bid bigger equipment until I can hold a line as a commuter.
It may be a coin toss on ball night....first world problem right?! Looking forward to a great career at United. Thanks again, BK
I've been bouncing back and forth on 320 vs 737 still. An EWR 320 FO new hire bud who only hit IOE in late October just notched his first hard line for Feb and is a crazy ~80 of 155 (~55%) base seniority already, however at his overall company seniority while he'd be about 10-20% lower EWR 737 seniority he'd also be holding a line there as I looked at that Feb bid package. Looking at the EWR 737 lines vs. EWR 320, there are some rougher 737 redeyes and transcons (5-6 hr blocks) but guppy books almost 10 more hours (~86 vs. 76) and 20-40 block hours of international time...that's an extra $1,000.mo before dinner/bar tabs. The standard EWR 320 trips look like 3-days with 2-hops that average closer to 2-3 hour flights each and overnight in smaller cities....looks like a decidedly "easier" flying schedule than the 737 and a couple more days off too.
I'm thinking the other variable is how long I'd want to remain in either narrowbody out of the gate. I think there will perhaps be stronger movement in the 320 during 2016 with all the new A319s delivering, but if I'm thinking 2-3 years the 737 could overtake the bus when all the 2017 -700 deliveries begin? Am i right that the 2 x -900s (Jan & Feb) are the only guppy fleet gains for the rest of 2016? If we don't move to a domicile in Summer '17, I definitely won't vacancy bid bigger equipment until I can hold a line as a commuter.
It may be a coin toss on ball night....first world problem right?! Looking forward to a great career at United. Thanks again, BK
One quick added thought. Don't look too hard at the trip side of the equation. A few months back EWR320 was doing a lot of island international flying and had higher time lines. The way marketing is running the airline these days, you're likely to see the flying completely change every few months no matter what fleet you're in.
02-01-2016, 12:20 PM
#32
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2010
Posts: 2,639
Originally Posted by Sunvox
The way marketing is running the airline these days, you're likely to see the flying completely change every few months no matter what fleet you're in.
If you only chase the "flying" (layovers, city pairs, etc.) you're gonna get burned.
FWIW, I'm senior enough in my BES that I typically bid by trip number/date and very consistently get my first "choice" in PBS. The downside: my actual flying varies wildly based on the variables of trip construction in the bid package each month.
02-01-2016, 03:42 PM
#33
Weekend Warrior
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Apr 2013
Position: B737 FO
Posts: 63
Great inputs all...thanks again. I just spent a bunch of time chatting with my EWR 320 FO friend today and I think he has this former USAF 737 guy ready to try a stint driving a bus named fifi....sounds like the 320 Chief Pilot & team at Newark really works hard to make it like family and take care of the newbies. Smaller fleet but with up to 20 Air China A319s inbound in the next year and others bidding out to widebody, it sounds like movement should remain solid. Cheers, BK
p.s. Any early prognostications on how a brand new fleet integration like the A350-1000s will shake out in 2018? I'd imagine super senior right from the initial cadre....anyone with experience on how United operationalizes a new airframe?
p.s. Any early prognostications on how a brand new fleet integration like the A350-1000s will shake out in 2018? I'd imagine super senior right from the initial cadre....anyone with experience on how United operationalizes a new airframe?
02-01-2016, 05:31 PM
#34
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Joined APC: Oct 2010
Posts: 2,639
Originally Posted by bkC130
I'd imagine super senior right from the initial cadre....anyone with experience on how United operationalizes a new airframe?
Considering that it is in the highest pay band and is the supposed replacement for the 747, a reasonable guess would be to expect the routes that the 747 flies after a short period of domestic hub-to-hub MX shakedown and pilot OE flying.
So yes, it will go senior due to the killer combination of pay and productive international trips.
02-02-2016, 06:41 AM
#35
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Joined APC: Jul 2008
Posts: 854
One big difference in EWR for 737 vs 320 is the number of LGA trips.
The 737 has roughly 10% LGA trips while the 320 is over 60%.
I've been flying the line in EWR since late April on the 737 and have not done a single LGA trip. A friend hired two months earlier on the 320 is flying two to three LGA trips per month even though he freezes all LGA trips in the lowest pool.
The 737 has roughly 10% LGA trips while the 320 is over 60%.
I've been flying the line in EWR since late April on the 737 and have not done a single LGA trip. A friend hired two months earlier on the 320 is flying two to three LGA trips per month even though he freezes all LGA trips in the lowest pool.
02-02-2016, 10:41 AM
#36
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: Bus
Posts: 768
If you take EWR, you GOTTA go with the 737. Hands down some of the best flying around. 24 layovers at warm beach Caribbean destinations. I miss it! Flew the 737 at EWR for a few years and now on the bus to shed the whole commuting ugliness. The Bus is by far a superior plane to fly and work environment. But man, those trips outta EWR on the 73, almost makes you forget the crappy crashpad you're hanging out in, or spilling your meal when you hit some turbies, or the joy of having a jumpseater stuffed up there with you on a transcon.
02-04-2016, 02:49 AM
#39
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Joined APC: Sep 2010
Position: EWR 777 Captain
Posts: 1,715
Don't if the OP is still hangin' around, but I just looked at the flights from ORD to STL. I'm not sure how that can't be a perfect commute. There are a ton of flights and half are on American mainline MD80s. Now I hate commuting on the MD80 in the jumpseat 'cuz you gotta sit in the Gynecologist's chair, but is there some reason to discount the MD80 on American? Are there a ton of ex-TWA folks commuting or something?
Just wondering what might impact STL-ORD that hasn't been mentioned because honestly now that I look at the number of flights and see that there are a ton of mainline AA flights, it seems like a "slam-dunk".
What am I missing?
Just wondering what might impact STL-ORD that hasn't been mentioned because honestly now that I look at the number of flights and see that there are a ton of mainline AA flights, it seems like a "slam-dunk".
What am I missing?
02-04-2016, 03:04 AM
#40
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2012
Position: 737 FO
Posts: 328
Originally Posted by Sunvox
Don't if the OP is still hangin' around, but I just looked at the flights from ORD to STL. I'm not sure how that can't be a perfect commute. There are a ton of flights and half are on American mainline MD80s. Now I hate commuting on the MD80 in the jumpseat 'cuz you gotta sit in the Gynecologist's chair, but is there some reason to discount the MD80 on American? Are there a ton of ex-TWA folks commuting or something?
Just wondering what might impact STL-ORD that hasn't been mentioned because honestly now that I look at the number of flights and see that there are a ton of mainline AA flights, it seems like a "slam-dunk".
What am I missing?
Just wondering what might impact STL-ORD that hasn't been mentioned because honestly now that I look at the number of flights and see that there are a ton of mainline AA flights, it seems like a "slam-dunk".
What am I missing?
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