Notices

UPS 2019 Hiring

Old 09-25-2019, 06:06 PM
  #471  
Gets Weekends Off
 
SaltyDog's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Dec 2005
Position: Leftof longitudinal
Posts: 1,899
Default

Originally Posted by WhenPigsFLy View Post
I think all hires from 2014 on will regret coming to both UPS and Fedex as we see Amazon grow and change the industry. Your peers at AA, UAL and DAL will move up rapidly while you stagnate. The domestic lines are unlivible long term and even 74 is getting bad. Just not smart to come here with the retirements there and uncertain future in express/cargo.
All??? Industry is always changing and has been as the markets change. Same on pax side. Every decade is different.
SaltyDog is offline  
Old 09-25-2019, 06:39 PM
  #472  
Banned
 
Joined APC: Jun 2014
Posts: 311
Default

Originally Posted by WhenPigsFLy View Post
I think all hires from 2014 on will regret coming to both UPS and Fedex as we see Amazon grow and change the industry. Your peers at AA, UAL and DAL will move up rapidly while you stagnate. The domestic lines are unlivible long term and even 74 is getting bad. Just not smart to come here with the retirements there and uncertain future in express/cargo.
Your username name is all that one needs to see to understand your post.
howardhughes8 is offline  
Old 09-26-2019, 11:09 AM
  #473  
Gets Weekends Off
 
gsphuntr's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Jul 2008
Position: Reverse cowgirl
Posts: 245
Default

Originally Posted by WhenPigsFLy View Post
I think all hires from 2014 on will regret coming to both UPS and Fedex as we see Amazon grow and change the industry. Your peers at AA, UAL and DAL will move up rapidly while you stagnate. The domestic lines are unlivible long term and even 74 is getting bad. Just not smart to come here with the retirements there and uncertain future in express/cargo.
You’ve been preaching the sky is falling for years on here.. do you live in a bunker? Wear a tinfoil hat? SMFH
gsphuntr is offline  
Old 09-26-2019, 12:39 PM
  #474  
Social Media retired.
Thread Starter
 
Joined APC: May 2018
Posts: 768
Default

Originally Posted by WhenPigsFLy View Post
I think all hires from 2014 on will regret coming to both UPS and Fedex as we see Amazon grow and change the industry. Your peers at AA, UAL and DAL will move up rapidly while you stagnate. The domestic lines are unlivible long term and even 74 is getting bad. Just not smart to come here with the retirements there and uncertain future in express/cargo.
Yes! Someone finally said it!!! The legacy airlines have been the bastion of stability and seniority progression in the last few decades and will continue to be in the future. Stay away from logistics and express cargo...mic drop.
FTv3 is offline  
Old 10-03-2019, 05:34 AM
  #475  
Gets Weekends Off
 
Joined APC: Aug 2018
Posts: 241
Default

Originally Posted by FTv3 View Post
Yes! Someone finally said it!!! The legacy airlines have been the bastion of stability and seniority progression in the last few decades and will continue to be in the future. Stay away from logistics and express cargo...mic drop.
Of the 5 described above, which have gone bankrupt?

Which have their business models under existential threat from ULCC and the stagnating (or regressing) American median income?

Which ones have had messy lot integration issues from multiple drawn out mergers?

...there isn’t an obvious answer of which is best for a 30 year career starting now since none of us has a crystal ball. The future has a funny way of destroying predictive certainties.

The only thing I’m willing to bet on is AA will be in major trouble the next recession. Beyond that who knows.
flightlessbirds is offline  
Old 10-22-2019, 11:13 AM
  #476  
Line Holder
 
Joined APC: Dec 2016
Posts: 44
Default

How worried are fairly new hires at UPS of the possibility of furlough when the next economic dip/recession hits?
I know the company is strong now, and growing, but are retirements and growth strong enough to keep everyone comfortable? Honestly curious.
MikeC5 is offline  
Old 10-22-2019, 11:48 AM
  #477  
The NeverEnding Story
 
BoilerUP's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Sep 2005
Posts: 7,474
Default UPS 2019 Hiring

The big difference between now and 2010 are retirements, which are running at least double (currently about triple) mandatory numbers.

Even if the MD fleet was parked en masse and dry leased 767s returned/not taken, the -8s and 767s delivered and to be delivered would make overall fleet size a push.

Probably worth noting domestic Next Day Air volume is up 24% per today’s Q3 earnings release.
BoilerUP is offline  
Old 10-22-2019, 04:39 PM
  #478  
Gets Weekends Off
 
Joined APC: Feb 2013
Posts: 1,339
Default

Originally Posted by MikeC5 View Post
How worried are fairly new hires at UPS of the possibility of furlough when the next economic dip/recession hits?
I know the company is strong now, and growing, but are retirements and growth strong enough to keep everyone comfortable? Honestly curious.

I don’t think newhires need to worry about the possibility of a furlough. Just like Boiler said, there are numerous differences between what we see today and what we saw back then.

Having said that, I’d like to mention that we saw many pilots retire early (prior to 60) back then too. In fact, some of us junior guys and gals were amazed at how quickly we were moving up. The economy was good, we were getting more 76s and many captains were leaving at 58, 59, etc.

Then, seemingly overnight, pretty much ALL early retirements came to a screeching halt because the stock market dropped once recession had finally kicked in.
Point being, IF there’s a huge market drop you’ll see the very same trend - people will stick around for as long as they can. You won’t see a single person leave even a day early.

The other issue that truly ‘hurt’ all newhires back then was the age 65 retirement age change.
Passenger airlines didn’t have any flight engineers - we had hundreds. So while passenger airline pilots saw a major stagnation, we, junior pilots, saw massive regression in seniority and 109 of those junior pilots ended up losing their jobs, some of them for 4+ years.
Remember, age 65 rule meant that flight engineers who’re still under 65 could come back to the left seat displacing junior captains in those seat, who’d then displace junior FOs to flight engineers seats, who’d then displace junior flight engineers to ...them being furloughed.

The difference between now and then is that when age retirement changes again, and it will, to let’s say 68 (i.e. Japan scenario) everyone will see stagnation just the way passenger pilots saw back then. However, since we no longer have any flight engineers who can displace junior captains from their seats we’d see a stagnation but not a regression. A HUGE difference from back then.

If the economy gets so bad the company chooses to retire MD11s sooner than everyone anticipates and if they defer deliveries of airplanes already purchased - I’d say all bets are off.
Just don’t see that happening anytime soon....

So to answer your original question, I think new-hires should have very little to worry about. These are good times to be a newbie at any major airline.
whalesurfer is offline  
Old 10-22-2019, 06:03 PM
  #479  
Banned
 
Joined APC: Jun 2014
Posts: 311
Default

Originally Posted by whalesurfer View Post

I don’t think newhires need to worry about the possibility of a furlough. Just like Boiler said, there are numerous differences between what we see today and what we saw back then.

Having said that, I’d like to mention that we saw many pilots retire early (prior to 60) back then too. In fact, some of us junior guys and gals were amazed at how quickly we were moving up. The economy was good, we were getting more 76s and many captains were leaving at 58, 59, etc.

Then, seemingly overnight, pretty much ALL early retirements came to a screeching halt because the stock market dropped once recession had finally kicked in.
Point being, IF there’s a huge market drop you’ll see the very same trend - people will stick around for as long as they can. You won’t see a single person leave even a day early.

The other issue that truly ‘hurt’ all newhires back then was the age 65 retirement age change.
Passenger airlines didn’t have any flight engineers - we had hundreds. So while passenger airline pilots saw a major stagnation, we, junior pilots, saw massive regression in seniority and 109 of those junior pilots ended up losing their jobs, some of them for 4+ years.
Remember, age 65 rule meant that flight engineers who’re still under 65 could come back to the left seat displacing junior captains in those seat, who’d then displace junior FOs to flight engineers seats, who’d then displace junior flight engineers to ...them being furloughed.

The difference between now and then is that when age retirement changes again, and it will, to let’s say 68 (i.e. Japan scenario) everyone will see stagnation just the way passenger pilots saw back then. However, since we no longer have any flight engineers who can displace junior captains from their seats we’d see a stagnation but not a regression. A HUGE difference from back then.

If the economy gets so bad the company chooses to retire MD11s sooner than everyone anticipates and if they defer deliveries of airplanes already purchased - I’d say all bets are off.
Just don’t see that happening anytime soon....

So to answer your original question, I think new-hires should have very little to worry about. These are good times to be a newbie at any major airline.
So put in simple terms, between late 2000’s and early 2010’s, we had the absolute perfect storm of events. The worst recession since the mid 1900’s (near depression), extension of retirement age and many Flight engineers, and still, of course with the full help of Brown brothers and sisters, only (and not downplaying those who temporarily lost their job) 109 went unemployed, of course it could of been much worse, although many have told me the furlough was completely unnecessary.

The point is, to reiterate the points made, even if we enter a recession in the near future, EVERY economist is saying it is going to be nothing like we saw earlier this decade. The experts say we don’t remember what a normal recession looks like, which doesn’t impact the economy nearly as much.

As a relatively new guy, I would not hesitate again to come to UPS today. Nothing is guaranteed, but outlook for all aviation jobs looks good. Heck, even with Fedex’s recent speed bumps and their impending freeze (6-9 months is rumor), I would absolutely go there first chance if presented the offer.
howardhughes8 is offline  
Old 10-26-2019, 08:52 AM
  #480  
Gets Weekends Off
 
Joined APC: Dec 2013
Posts: 1,602
Default

How long does it take to hear from the hiring team after the Hogan?
NovemberBravo is offline  
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
FTFF
UPS
386
06-04-2018 08:44 PM
jlg79
Cargo
154
05-24-2014 09:27 AM
767pilot
Cargo
113
10-15-2009 06:19 PM
FR8K9
Cargo
12
10-06-2008 05:02 AM
Cujo
Cargo
4
10-01-2007 10:08 PM

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Your Privacy Choices