WinggedHussars

Hey guys,


I was wondering if there may be some insight into how UPS may view me should I apply right now, given I have maybe not the most excellent history with the company.


My main concern is that more than a decade ago, I worked as a UPS seasonal truck loader at a ground sort facility in the Carolinas. I was terrible at the job, and I was a young and dumb teenager. After peak was over, I was pretty much told I have converted to a non-seasonal employee automatically, or at least that I would be, I am not sure. But I wasn't very strong, and my trucks were always a mess and very backed up, and at times, without getting help from some of the "super loaders." the belt feeding my truck would get so backed up it would affect the whole line by causing a jam. I was not a good fit for the job. I was a skinny nerdy kid with no strength. So, at the end of my shift, and at the end of the week, after yet another rush resulting in me getting buried alive in my truck and generally creating a mess by not being a very good box tosser, I told my supervisor that I was terrible at my job. I was causing more harm than good, and I would not be returning on Monday. My supervisor told me not to leave and not to worry, they'd get me help and extra training and they'd fix me. I said unless you guys can get me an extra 20lbs of muscle mass over the weekend, I don't think additional training will help, and I feel like a burden. It just isn't the job for me, but thank you for everything, and I left. Well, I don't think the supervisor ever told HR that I told them I was quitting. I got a couple of calls from HR the next week asking me if I would be coming into work, which I never returned because I was embarrassed by the whole situation, so it probably looks like straight-up job abandonment in the official record.


Fast forward to now, and I'm a 30-year-old MD11 First Officer at an ACMI carrier. (So its pretty obvious which ACMI Carrier)


I have a little over 5000 hours total time, roughly 3500 of that is in turbojets, approximately 1000 of that is MD11 SIC and approximately a thousand of that is EMB-145 PIC at a previous carrier (the rest of the jet time is EMB-145 SIC)


I love freight and have decided that in the grand scheme of things, I would be much happier at UPS or FDX than at the passenger legacies, and at my age, there is no reason I should settle for a career at ACMIs. UPS is my number one choice because of the pay structure across the fleets, and let's be honest you guys appear to have an incredible labor agreement from someone on the outside looking in.


I am roughly 10% of the way into a 4-year computer science degree. I know it's not expressly required right now, but I'm guessing it might as well be, but that will take the time it takes. FDX is absolutely a non-option without the degree, but I have heard of people getting hired at UPS without one.


Will ups have held a grudge about the business as a seasonal loader from 2008? Could I be blacklisted by HR or something as do not hire? Or is this possibly something that the time and what I've done in between and that they are two dramatically different jobs would render it not that big of a deal? I haven't seen the application, so I'm not sure if it even asks about things from that long ago, but I'm sure it will come up cause I'm sure I'm on the computer and I had an employee number.


Should I apply now? Should I wait until I finish my degree and then apply? Or did dumb teenage me hose myself out of the opportunity?

PA31

Apply and own it if they call to interview you...
Finishing your degree and a solid work history since then should help.

WinggedHussars

Right on. Is a professional resume, application, and interview prep service worth the money do you think? There are places that offer resume reviews and application streamlining and interview prep all in a package but its got a hefty price tag.

We've had a couple of people go to you guys recently successfully, and at least one that I know if bust an interview there too. This isn't one to not pull out all the stops for.

airupser41

Finish the degree as soon as you can, not just for your prospects here but for job prospects anywhere. I’ve flown with exactly one pilot at UPS who didn’t have a degree, and he was hired in 1988. Whether it should be a discriminator or not doesn’t matter; it is, and likely will be even more important as a glut of pilots enter the job market. As far as UPS work history, I agree with the post above - all you can do is own it. They do keep your old employee number, occasionally new hires show up with employee numbers that make it look like they have 15 or 20 years here. Turns out they were loaders at some point in their past.

PA31

In full disclosure- I’m at FedEx not UPS. If I were in your shoes- as soon as I was maybe a quarter away from finishing my degree I’d start preparing for an interview. I like Emerald Coast for interview prep, but most of the big prep services do a good job.

WinggedHussars

Oh I full well mean to finish it no natter what. Its also non aviation because of the fickle nature of this industry and i need a fall back option.

Im sure it will be a descriminator especially right now with all the pilots already on the streets and about 4500 UAL pilots on the way.

Im hoping my MD11 time will help. I am doing the exact same job in the exact same AC for less money right now pretty much. But I know, degrees matter.

Thanks everyone.

Spoiler

think it's going to be determined by what your supv wrote about your termination. Obviously, you cannot omit your svc there and people do move on to bigger and better things. UPS of yesteryear had a strict no rehire policy. Doesn't matter - until your within a few months of finishing your degree the policy may be different anyway.

WinggedHussars

Im pretty sure my supervisor would have wrote that I quit without 2 weeks notice. I did not however do that in writing which I now know always resign for anything in wiriting. I worked at a huge sort facility that probably had 500+ employees if I were to guess handled by two HR guys that worked in a seperate building. Im not sure if they even talked to my supervisor or if nobody said anything and when I didnt show up on monday they just called it a no call/no show and "terminated" me. Honestly, id love to know. I wonder if ups would release my personnel file to me if I reached out and requested it so I know how to communicate it properly when I applied. That may be worth persueing. It seems silly to not rehire a pilot for quitting a seasonal loader job 12 or 13 years ago but as you said, i had heard a strict and unilateral no rehire policy existed.

You think I should wait to apply untill a couple months from degree completion and not apply now even though technically I can check the minimums boxes but cant check the preferred box?

Id say that would make it 15+ years ago by that point and fingers crossed a good chunk of pic time in the MD11 too.

Do you know if there is a certain flight hour threshold were UPS considers you "too set in your ways"? Ive heard the legacy carriers arent fond of anyone 8000+ and without a new type rating in the past 6 years but its all rumors and here say. Fortunately up untill covid, I was only averaging 300-400 hours a year and at this point, im not really in need of time building. I check all the preferred boxes except for my lack of degree which is the single greatest obstacle to my career advancement in any direction and it needs to be my priority.

I keep getting mixed answers though. Some people tell me to apply now anyway and just keep updating the application and other people tell me to wait. I also have internal references potentially but im not sure how much difference that would make in this situation.

tallpilot

Sadly, mixed answers is all you are going to get unless you get a job in HR. There are rules and there are exceptions to the rules. The only guarantee is if you don’t apply, you won’t get a call. You have a solid plan, just keep working it and try not to agonize over things you can’t control. (Yes, I know how hard that is, people who become pilots don’t like things they can’t control.)

TiredSoul

I’m flabbergasted that some here seem to think that a seasonal job from 12(!) years ago would now be held against you by a company like UPS.