Go Back   Airline Pilot Central Forums > Career Builder > Military
Register FAQ Advertising Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Military Career | Transition to airline pilot

 

Welcome to Airline Pilot Forums

    Already registered? Login above

OR
 
To take advantage of all the site's features, become a member of
the largest community of airline pilots in the U.S. and beyond.

The advertising to the left will not show if you are a registered user.

Join the Forum

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 07-10-2009, 01:18 PM   #1 (permalink)
Line Holder
 
Joined APC: Jun 2008
Posts: 33
Default F-22 problems

There's an article in today's Washington Post about serious problems with the F-22:

Premier U.S. Fighter Jet Has Major Shortcomings

I'm interested in hearing some expert commentary on the issues raised in this article. Specifically:
  1. Quality problems with stealth coatings and the canopy
  2. Low readiness due to high maintenance
  3. Huge cost overruns
  4. "Unilateral disarmament" caused by the F-22 sucking up all resources that would otherwise go to modernizing other weapons systems
  5. The F-22's inability "to communicate with other types of warplanes"
Thanks.
radmanly is offline   Reply With Quote
Advertising above will not show if you are a registered user.
Old 07-10-2009, 01:49 PM   #2 (permalink)
Gets Weekends Off
 
KC10 FATboy's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Jun 2007
Position: Legacy FO
Posts: 3,922
Default

Why am I not surprised by this. I did a fighter movement with these guys and they were plagued with emergencies. Hopefully they can work out the bugs and make this thing the fighter it was meant to be.
KC10 FATboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-10-2009, 01:55 PM   #3 (permalink)
Line Holder
 
Joined APC: Jun 2008
Posts: 33
Default

I also wonder about the strategic implications of this kind of complexity. If you lose an F-22, how many months does it take to make a new one? This isn't like WWII where new planes were rolling off a converted automobile assembly line every hour. If it takes many months to build one, could America ever find itself in a situation where it has more planes in the factories than it has in the fight? Surely someone in the Pentagon has considered this. I just wonder what the plan is.
radmanly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-10-2009, 02:30 PM   #4 (permalink)
Prime Minister
 
rickair7777's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Position: CRJ
Posts: 16,199
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by radmanly View Post
I also wonder about the strategic implications of this kind of complexity. If you lose an F-22, how many months does it take to make a new one? This isn't like WWII where new planes were rolling off a converted automobile assembly line every hour. If it takes many months to build one, could America ever find itself in a situation where it has more planes in the factories than it has in the fight? Surely someone in the Pentagon has considered this. I just wonder what the plan is.
Since they are shutting down the production line, you will never be able to make a new one. You will only be able to replace it with an in-production airplane or an older type from the boneyard.

But that is not really an issue in the modern world. Conventional warfare between nations would be over in weeks, or months at the outside. You fight with what you have on hand when the balloon goes up.
rickair7777 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-10-2009, 02:46 PM   #5 (permalink)
Line Holder
 
Joined APC: Jun 2008
Posts: 33
Default

OK. Thanks for the replies.

Given the problems with the F-22, was it a good idea to end the program? Consuming all of the resources for other programs seems like a major liability. I can't believe they built a plane that can't talk to other planes.
radmanly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-10-2009, 07:41 PM   #6 (permalink)
Gets Weekends Off
 
CAFB 04-12's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Feb 2006
Position: Various
Posts: 264
Default

I can't imagine how badly mission effectiveness would suffer if the F-22 were actually in the fight in the sand box. These things are babied like the multi-million dollar treasures they are and can't hold up to normal day-to-day wear and tear?

I know, let's just buy 665 of them.
CAFB 04-12 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-10-2009, 07:44 PM   #7 (permalink)
No one's home
 
III Corps's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,091
Default

Don't know about expert opinion but I have followed the development and introduction of the -22. It is light years ahead of the -15 and -16 it replaced. The tasks it was assigned are also different in that it was to super-cruise (which nothing else does), be stealthy and be superior to anything the Chinese or Russians were fielding. That is rapidly changing and the latest Flanker is reportedly 'not your father's flanker'. The Chinese are being especially aggressive in fielding new fighters and in number. And the Chinese knock-off is being marketed world wide, a point which had angered the Russians to the point they are NOT offering the Chinese a look at the new Flanker, the SU-25.

This is their J-10 which reportedly has a lot of the Israeli Lavi design in it. The Lavi as I am sure you know never went into production.


The -22 has had problems. No highly sophisticated machine has entered service without problems. The B-1 is a prime example but we could go back to the early Century Series fighters to see the same thing repeated.

Follow the money. The USAF wants lots of new F-35s although the critique of it is short legs, underpowered, not very nimble. And to get the money for the -35, they have to kill the Raptor. And what we will wind up with is a -22 fleet too small to justify the maint and too small to meet the emerging threats.

I could be wrong.

Oh... I would never use the WashPost as the source for the truth on anything.
__________________
Simple solutions are seldom either.
III Corps is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-10-2009, 08:19 PM   #8 (permalink)
Gets Weekends Off
 
1Seat 1Engine's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Aug 2006
Position: 737 Right
Posts: 1,259
Default

It's light years ahead of the F-15 and F-16?

I would certainly hope so. It's only been thirty years since those airplanes first flew.

The F-22 is incredibly good at a very small skill set. To me, it's doubtful that we needed to sacrifice so much budget to get the nth degree of capability.

The bottom line is the USAF tried to do too much and mortgaged it's entire future on this aircraft.

There were much better and lower risk alternatives.
1Seat 1Engine is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-10-2009, 09:18 PM   #9 (permalink)
"miserable user"
 
Joined APC: Feb 2006
Position: DD->DH->RU/XE soon to be EV
Posts: 3,732
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by III Corps View Post
The tasks it was assigned are also different in that it was to super-cruise (which nothing else does)
Maybe it depends on the definition, are you talking 1.5 mach, or just above mach 1?

If you're talking just above 1.0 mach does not the Eurofighter Typhoon and the JAS-39 Gripen have the ability as far as current military airplanes go?
dojetdriver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-11-2009, 07:31 AM   #10 (permalink)
Gets Weekends Off
 
TBoneF15's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Apr 2007
Posts: 248
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1Seat 1Engine View Post
There were much better and lower risk alternatives.
For example?
TBoneF15 is offline   Reply With Quote
 
 
 

 
Reply
 



« Previous Thread | Next Thread »
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


LinkBacks (?)
LinkBack to this Thread: http://www.airlinepilotforums.com/military/41850-f-22-problems.html
Posted By For Type Date
F-22 Waste Exposed At New Depths This thread Refback 07-21-2009 11:28 AM
F-22 Waste Exposed At New Depths This thread Refback 07-13-2009 08:34 AM

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
A380 Problems Ottopilot Major 35 03-08-2009 07:37 PM
FDX alpa jumpseat site problems usmc-sgt Cargo 2 01-28-2009 08:10 AM
Any problems with Homeowner's Associations ryan1234 Hangar Talk 27 01-07-2009 06:24 AM
Couple more problems in Chicago inky13 Major 0 12-24-2008 10:37 PM
Boeing Confirms More Nutplate Problems FBEDCOM Major 8 12-01-2008 11:11 PM


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 06:26 AM.


vBulletin® v3.8.6, Copyright ©2000-2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.1
Copyright 2000 - 2012 Internet Brands, Inc.