ClearedHot1

We are talking about an alternate. So we already have planned to go to another field and were required to divert. During our divert we lost a motor AND our divert field is at or below minimums. It is my opinion you have done more than required to meet your AIB board president. You have done your due diligence.

I would much rather lose a motor at 200' (ILS CAT I) and 140kts than 0' at V1. I imagine that is why we talk about losing a motor on take off much more often than approach.

kme9418

Again...in the USAF...IFR, you need to meet the missed approach climb gradient with one engine inoperative:

AFI11-202V3 7 NOVEMBER 2014, General Flight Rules

7.8.2.2.1. If unable to meet published missed approach climb gradient OEI, and
operationally necessary, the MAJCOM/A3 may authorize subtraction of up to
48’/NM from the missed approach climb gradient. This authority may be further
delegated, but may not be delegated to the respective aircrew for which the waiver
would apply (T-1).

Here is another reference:

AFMAN11-217V1 22 OCTOBER 2010, Instrument Flight Procedures

14.4.3. Climb Gradient. The pilot shall ensure that the aircraft can achieve the published
climb gradient. When the gradient is not published, climb at least 200 feet per nautical
mile in order to clear obstructions. See AFI 11-202V3, for engine out performance
requirements.

PurpleToolBox

KME is correct.

Some have said that they would rather be on final with an engine failure then on the runway at V1. I'm not saying you're wrong or right, but consider this scenario.

Most big airplanes in the USAF are using tailored engine-out special departure procedures by Jeppesen, but not all communities (typical USAF standardization). However, these procedures are for leaving the runway at the departure end. When you are on final and get to minimums, you may be a mile or more from the departure end of a 2-mile long runway; therefore, the obstacles along your path might vary thus rendering the Jeppesen SDP useless. And unless you know the terrain and obstacles around the airport you're flying to, you may not know if the JeppSDP can be of any help.

You must meet the OEI missed approach climb gradient criteria when flying an instrument approach.

To the OP: please save these types of questions for your Instructor or Standards and Evaluations shop. The internet can and is often wrong.

ClearedHot1

Affirm, KME was correct the first time he identified the 11-202V3 reference.

I agree with the the nod towards "standardization". My community does not touch Jep. I imagine the OP identifying himself as a King Air PIC is probably not a very well supported community.... Not "big".

I agree with your discussion of distance, but I clearly see that as an advantage. Missed at 1/2 mile final with the departure end two miles away. I would be climbing and not immediately starting a departure procedure (turn) designed for a point 2.5 miles away.

Vito

ClearedHot,
Just curious, what AF aircraft do you fly thats thrust deficient?

galaxy flyer

The mighty C-5 comes to mind as "thrust deficient", every mission take-off was an exercise in compromise between take-off perf and range.

GF

Adlerdriver

Why would this even be a question. No one would be turning early if they know what they're doing. Missed approach procedures or some kind of departure procedures are all about ground track. It's not an option to commence a MAP turn prior to the missed approach point if you happen to miss early.

DownAndDirty

You have to meet the MA climbout assuming OEI, as quoted above from the 202v3. For those saying "I wouldn't shoot an approach to mins if I lost an engine", well there are probably 100 scenarios I could come up with where you might have to. Keep in mind you won't always be CONUS with nice TERPS'd DoD approaches in flat terrain to give you the warm and fuzzy. If you've never shot this approach, take a look at the ILS 29 into OAKB and note the MA climb gradients given the two different sets of mins. Would you be able to legally shoot this approach down to the lowest set of mins?

nsavandal09

True, but if you are flying IFR in VMC you can always declare an emergency, cancel IFR and state your intentions to ATC. You should have already done a thorough terrain study, your single engine performance, the minimum ceiling/vis weather you need and have an idea for what you're going to do beforehand and you can execute from there.
If you're VFR you still need the higher of 200 ft/nm (or 152 if you get it waived) or the min IFR gradient, but if the departure procedure/missed approach is taking you north and you need a 400 ft/nm gradient but you look out the window and decide to turn south that IFR gradient no longer applies

Bottom line is know what's safe, smart and legal and hack the mission from there.

Tummy

Absent people getting shot at, why would you ever want to get the climb gradient waved? If it's this hard to figure out if an airport is a good alternate, and you aren't in combat (<-- might not be an accurate assumption), why would you want to work this hard to use it as an alternate?

Find somewhere else to go. Of course, I'm an aviation nerd at heart and like the discussion regarding technical specifics, but I'm reminded of the culture I used to experience in the military where we were always compromising safety for no good reason.