Originally Posted by
slowplay
It's a great ancillary business. Tell me again how much those 9 dedicated freighters lost us in 2008 before the shutdown?
Point is, FedEx and UPS have created a duopoly in their overnight package delivery business. They ran ABX, DHL, and the USPS into insignficant market share. They are both extremely profitable and are paying some of the highest wage rates in the US piloting business. Their main deck freighter counterparts (Atlas, Kalitta, et. al.) pay less than us on like aircraft. APC shows Atlas at $176 per hour for a 747. Astar and ABX only have a few pilots left after massive furloughs.
whoops... According to the unionoid types and others, those freighters were mismanaged into the ground even losing the DHL contract before DL even took control of the operation. It's pretty bad to lose a contract of a horribly run company trying their hand at being the low cost in the express business. USPS... well, that's the government for you.
Had we kept the freighters, we would (with appropriate management of them) be among the ranks of Atlas and Kalitta making absolute gobs of money and buying new 747-400s and 747-800s on the worldwide large freight business. Would 30 dollars an hour difference on flight crews make or break that operation? Give me a freaking break if you think that's the case.
I sure wish we were part of that, don't you?
Because making fact based emotional arguments ( such as I'm doing the same job) hasn't worked in a long time. If they did Lloyd Hill and APA would be sitting on a 52% payraise right now and we'd pattern off of them. If they did, there wouldn't be such huge disparities in pay for pilots in the same aircraft and industry. There wouldn't be a $70 per hour difference betweek FedEx and Atlas heavy drivers. There wouldn't be a $40/hr difference between USAirways and Delta A320 pilots. Even in your personal history you joined 9E whose contract was substantially beneath CMR and ASA while you guys flew the same airplane. Why was that?
All the points you raise are fact. Look at the recent history of contract negotiations. Tell me what arguments worked and which ones didn't. I'm looking for the winning argument, not the populist and feel good ones.
I would like the winning arguments as well... and just so you know, when I joined 9E we were average to above average on CRJ-200 pay. I applied to ASA and 9E and got called by 9E first. CMR didn't come on the map as I could see the writing on the wall there. Also, with the aircraft orders on the books at 9E at that point in time, I upgraded to CA in 14 months. That would have taken 4 years to do at ASA, so you tell me who made more money?
At 9E, there was then 7 years of negotiations assisted by ALPA's finest lawyers, right?
(much more complicated that, I can't resist taking a jab when I can)