Originally Posted by
etflies
It is clear that you've been around a while, and have a fair amount of wisdom to share but with all due respect, have you tried to get by on regional FO wages in the last few years? Especially the first couple years? Not making money isn't something to just "get over." The little things add up fast. I'll skip the haircut to buy healthier groceries, or make sure I can afford my student loan payment but my longer hair will also be combed and gel-free. I know I wasn't the only FO making a concerted effort to live within his means, and I became particularly good at reducing spending to a minimum. I lived in an area that was cheaper than my base, but required commuting to work, which meant a crash pad or hotel cost due to the schedules we had. When I moved to my base, the cost of living increased. It was a choice I made and was able to make work but never the less there was a trade off either way. I say this more as a response to the "get over it" comment, and not the idea that one's respect or professionalism is somehow connected directly to one's pay.
I wholeheartedly agree that using pay as an excuse is a cop out. If when I was on 1st year pay I still managed to iron a uniform, buff up my shoes once in a while and keep the ipod out of my ears everyone can but it isn't as black and white as you made it out to be. I'll take the time before a trip to iron my uniform, and shine my shoes but if you catch me asking for a ride home after leg 6, on day 4, hour 14, I'm not going to look top notch.
My "get over it" comment was aimed at for paying for a haircut. I go to an old gal who charges $10. I always give her a $20. Yes, that's a 100% tip, but she's a nice old lady and tells a good yarn when you are in her chair, and shaves my neck.
Do you think I was never on New Hire pay? Do you think I woke up one day in the left seat of a 777, and never "paid my dues"? You would be sadly mistaken if that's what you think. When I started flying a twin turbo prop at night, I was paid a salary (a flat rate, not by the hours flown) of $150 per week, in 1979. In an average week we flew 25 hours hard time, no such thing as 'credit time' at any part 135 outfit. That's $6 per hour for flying a twin engine turbo prop from Boston to Detroit through JFK, and back, all night.
I checked Tom's Inflation Calculator, that works out to about $517 per week in today's dollars, (about $20/hr.) which, if my math is right, is about $2067/mo. or $24,816 yr. in today's dollars. I know some of the Saab guys probably make less. Still, if you can't afford to cut your hair, get your wife/girlfriend to do it for you.
I lived in my parent's basement the first two years, until I graduated college, no joke, but I was flying every night, 9pm-6am, and going to college every day, 8am-noon, so I wasn't there all that much, just to sleep from 1pm-7pm, get up, drive an hour to BOS, fly to JFK, then to DET, back to JFK, then back to BOS. 4 legs, all night, every night, M-F, weekends off. It was strictly a 'time building' job, not something I wanted to do forever.
I figured as soon as I graduated college I'd get an airline job, but in 1981, when I graduated from UNH, the ATC guys went on strike, all the Majors stopped hiring, and I was looking at flying the Turbo Commode all night, for a long time.
It was only when a C141 guy, who also flew the Lear 23 in the daytime, at the same part 135 co. I was at, told me about the Air Guard, that I started looking at getting into the Air Guard. It took me two more years of tests, inteviews and begging, but I finally got in. Starting pay, 2nd LT. in the Air Force back then (1983) was about $20,000/yr., after all those years of $150/wk. I thought I was rich!
BUT...yeah, no matter where you are flying, the fist few years, the pay sucks, no doubt. And with the stagnation brought on by the Age 65 thing, (which I was opposed to) and all the industry consolodation, it's only gotten worse and there is very little upward movement.
I won't pay for my 19 yr. old son to take flying lessons, I told him if he really wants to do it, he's going to have to pay for it...forever, or join the military and let Uncle pay for it.