This is supposed to be an "Opportunity" and if TO and the NC (one CA, Two F/Os) negotiates a bad early TA (with no pressure from the membership to get the agreement like there might be a 12-18 mos AFTER expiration of the current PWA) then they are totally incompetent and based on people I trust knowing the people on the NC if we get in a TA in the next couple of months AND it is forwarded to the membership for ratification I think it will be pretty good (maybe I'm naive). As for payrates let's take a look at a scenario where 11% works (pay rate is not the be all and end all). Daily minimum goes to 6:00/calendar day, vacation goes up to 6:00/day, training goes to 6:00/day, remote training goes to a minute of pay for a minute of running time, DC contribution goes up 2%/year until we reach 20%, reserve guarantee goes to 75 hours with max days on reduced to from 18/19 to 17/18 - haven't done the math but all of those would make a much bigger take home plus more in the 401 (which doesn't show up on the W2). I won't even get into the scope issues (that is a book into itself). Bottom line, we'll need to look at the whole thing (hopefully some of the math wizards will help translate some of the pay/work rule improvements into some real world examples/numbers. Would love to get an early TA that kicks in Jan 1, 2013.