Originally Posted by
bigshinyjet
Jay,
I have seen your pride in Delta in someone else I've known for most of my life. I call the guy with the pride "Dad". He loved that airline until he was about 48ish. Right about the time Reid showed up his pride disappeared and the sense of abandonment came out in anger and frustration. His retirement was threatened, he got his lump some and got out while his monthly pension is now paid out at $1 for every $100 it should be...he gets $800 a month instead of $8000.
I am telling you this because before you come on a Spirit thread telling us that our contract is substandard. Try going on a Fedex, UPS or Southwest thread and brag about what you tentatively just got so they can tell you how it rates.
I am glad things are going well at Delta right now since many, and possibly most of my family friends work there still. However, keep in mind that if the internet existed when my dad was a L1011 FE he might have gone on a Southwest forum and bashed them for flying so many legs with a subpar contract and pay!
Another interesting conversation would be, did Spirits Pay rates help you get that TA? Because if I know Delta Pilots and I know a few, they all asked me all the time what our pay rates were going to and did not understand how an A320 driver at Spirit could be making more than one at Delta.
Also keep in mind that those new pay rates would be a lot harder to pay if Delta did not go bankrupt and lump their pension debt on the taxpayer of which most was just wiped out by the courts an PBGC.
I will put my QOL up against Delta, Southwest, United, etc. any day of the week. The difference is not QOL it is Risk. Our company is currently more risky than yours but then again when Delta furloughs again one day...and they will it will be around 2,000 pilots at one time and the furlough will last 10 years. Unless the imaginary pilot shortage helps out!
Last note Preferential Bidding gives the company a lot of power of you that you do not realize until it is to late, ask Continental guys. Enjoy the warm fuzzy feeling while it lasts.
Did not mean to type that much I am going to go get ready for my 23 days off next month!
Oh, I'm with ya. I would say I have pride, but the honeymoon was over when we sent 1300 to the street, dumped what was a pretty strong no-furlough clause from our contract, and then let (or at least
helped facilitate) the RJ explosion at DCI. I will admit our warts as quick as anyone who doesn't work here.
I don't agree with your furlough prediction, simply because of our retirement numbers. Of course I could be wrong, but just looking at the math, it seems highly unlikely for the next 15+ years. One day, maybe, who knows.
I also know what your saying about PBS, another thing I was livid about when we went to it during the furloughs further reducing the staffing requirements. It's not a new thing for us now. It's been here for, IDK, 7-8 years. I've used it both junior and (relatively) senior, and still prefer it on the whole with it's admitted negatives.
Again, it wasn't my intention to knock NKS pilots or the contract, I just hate to see us as pilots be happy with what management is trying to set as the "new norm." To convince us that we need to keep our contract costs down to industry minimums so the company can compete or even survive, all the while making big profits, and lining their pockets and golden parachutes. Skybus was, IMHO the worst manifestation we've seen of this in recent memory, and I don't want to see something else like them ever again. (not saying that that is what Spirit is, btw)
P.S. I know exactly how ours rates against at least some of those. I even worked in FedEx flight operations back in the day and still have enough contacts to know their CBA pretty well. You might be surprised how this TA could have us positioned by 2015. Like I said, everyone needs to keep moving the ball meaningfully forward.