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Old 12-19-2012 | 04:38 PM
  #34  
sizzlechest
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Originally Posted by nbecca
LOA 67 was negotiated between Frontier Airlines and the Frontier Airline Pilots Association when FAPA was the legal representative union.

--But it has been amended outside of the proper representation and intentional steps were made to cloud this fact (and others) to prevent the IBT from doing what it is authorized to. Maybe the time to vote on it was made so short because BB and F9 knew they had little time and didn't want IBT to stop it? isn't that why they tried to interfere with the representation elections and were shot down?

LOA 67 was ratified by the members of the Frontier Airline Pilots Association when FAPA was the legal representative union.

LOA 67 was the primary stimulus in the process of obtaining concessions from RAH/Frontier stakeholders/vendors. The stakeholders/vendors followed the pilot's lead on concessions.

Without concessions from the pilots and other stakeholders/vendors, Frontier would, more than likely, have struggled to survive.

Those concessions, from the pilots and the stakeholders/vendors allowed Frontier to hold down their CASM, ex-fuel, until the little jets drove the CASM up.

--When a little jet does an ABQ turn or COS turn with less than 20 people, yeah, it will drive things up. Who's responsible for deciding the routes for the little jets? Who chose to bid EAS work that was a loser revenue-wise? who had complete control over profitability of little jets?

If the IBT prevails, the Company loses XXMM in concessions from the pilots and possibly from some stakeholders/vendors, that would have a negative affect on the viability of Frontier.

--Then it means that it was illegal, no? Should illegalities be overlooked and concessions remain? Doesn't concessions have an impact on negotiations in the future for your airline's CBA or the CBA of another airline?

So, spout off all you want about the IBT's desire to legally represent all parties to the SLI ("we are one?") and avoid a DFR suit.

--Roger

The IBT's "stated" desire is to represent the Frontier pilots all the way down to bidding the 190's, but the truth of the matter is, the IBT is trying to overturn a legally ratified agreement between Frontier and their pilots.

--Apparently, the legality is a point in contention here.

If successful, it will cause harm to the Frontier pilot group.

--But the pilot group does not control how the airline operates or what it charges. They only fly the plane from A to B according to the rules. Managment is responsible for the business plans and profitability and whatever agreements were made with the associated stakeholders.

The Frontier pilots wanted this LOA, the Company (Frontier) wanted this LOA and it was agreed to in a completely legal manner.

--See above.

Who is the IBT to come in, after the fact, to "represent" the Frontier pilots (in the form of a lawsuit) against their wishes in a manner that will cause harm to the pilot group they are so "interested in representing?"

--The elected representive solely responsible for collective bargaining as an agent to the pilot group. They are responsible to ensure things are done ethically and legally IAW laws and bylaws for the represented parties on the single-seniority list. Don't try to convince anyone that it wasn't done hastily with the intention of avoiding proper IBT involvement. i know you have seen the evidence entered right there in black and white. try to tell me that it was all on the "up and up"...

Remember, RAH had nowhere to place the 190's except at Frontier (they would have been parked or sold) and RAH would have parked many more 170's without being able to operate them in the service of Frontier.

--Then so be it. Sheet happens. Management makes these decisions, not the pilots. Who knows if there would have been a different opportunity to open up then and nothing would have happened. Maybe the casino work would have come around sooner. The point is, nobody knows for sure but can only guess.

The fact that they were able to place them at Frontier saved native RAH pilots from furlough.

--That's great and all but see above. it's no wonder F9 pilots think they are better than the RAHBros...

You're welcome.

--Pffffft! "Surely you jest"!
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