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Old 08-18-2013, 01:10 PM
  #208  
zoooropa
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Joined APC: Jul 2009
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Originally Posted by Oskeewowow View Post
To prospective new hires, here is a quote from Arbitrator Eischen's ruling:



RAH pilots so far are not being allowed to bid these positions, violating the Eischen award. Consider that when you apply. We're all professionals, and integrity counts in this industry.
The Award doesn't apply to hiring or filling of vacancies. It hasn't applied to one single vacancy bid at RAH or F9 to date, why should it start now?

Originally Posted by JetBlast77 View Post
Right but if and when Frontier is sold the pilots are taken off of RAHs list and they are no longer affiliated correct?
Correct, Eischen specifically referred to "single" systems and the NMB specifically referred to the separation when RAH attempted to have the representation election delayed.

Originally Posted by Oskeewowow View Post
Sure, but how long will it take for the transaction to be completed and the lists to be formally separated? I would bet people will interview & be in class by then. Until the Eischen IMSL is taken apart, F9 management is violating an arbitrated award.
It took six months at the NMB the last time. I would expect the same time frame when we approach the NMB this time.

Originally Posted by RockyMntAV8R View Post
I have been waiting for this to be brought up. I think Oskee is correct and F9 is legally required to fill such positions in accordance with this ruling at this time. The last time F9 filled open positions they did so in accordance with this ruling. As much as I want the seperation to be complete asap, the fact is as of today it is not. I can see the possibility of a huge lawsuit looming on the horizon from this disregard of the ruling. All of us at F9 want the list seperated as soon as possible, no one more than me. As long as F9 is part of the RAH nightmare I believe we have to live by the ruling. I don't know why RAH decided not to abide by the ruling and hire from the outside.
This is not factually correct. F9 has never filled a vacancy pursuant to the Eischen Award. F9 hired several pilots (some of which resigned their seniority and some that did not resign their seniority) prior to The Award being issued. We have not hired anyone since The Award. F9 did have a Voluntary Staffing Adjustment (MKE closed, CHI opened) and those vacancies were NOT filled according to The Award, they were filled according to the F9 CBA (DOH seniority).

The Eischen Award doesn't apply to hiring.

Originally Posted by Bulldog319 View Post
The last time F9 filled open positions. The ones that maintained IMSL seniority were the furloughs. There are no longer any furloughs as everyone has had a chance to return to one of the four companies.

These open positions are first officer positions and, from what I understand of the Chatauqua CBA, none of the first officers at the other 3 airlines are allowed by their CBA to voluntarily switch certificates. The captains at the other 3 airlines are unable to bid first officer positions again. Any captain positions that come as a result of this hiring are still fenced.

There is not yet an amalgamated contract or transition agreement.

If I am wrong, please correct me with references to where this is allowed in the Chautauqua CBA. I would very much like to have the information.
You have some items correct and others incorrect. F9 did not hire "furloughs". The term "furlough" is defined by the F9 CBA. The CHQ CBA doesn't apply to this hiring event, just like the F9 CBA didn't apply to the RAH hiring of 190 and q400 pilots. You can't have it both ways (see oskee's post above about integrity). Where was all of this outrage when RAH was filling vacancies at RAH? Maybe I wanted to be a 190 CA (those are free to everyone according to Eischen). I can't bid 190 for the exact same reason you can't bid at F9. Where was the lawsuit when F9 filled the CHI domicile according to DOH? Any litigation regarding this hiring will be dead in the water based on past precedent.

Originally Posted by TillerEnvy View Post
An arbitration decision regarding an IMSL between separate lists sets the law for vacancies. Eischen made that ruling and it's pretty clear.
Eischen made several statements related to "hiring"...

"Pilots hired after October 1, 2009 are to be placed at the end of the
IMSL, by date of hire."

and

"Articulation
of the reciprocal fence protections in terms of "priorities" means that, to the extent fenced
positions remain open after the exercise of a protected groups priority rights, other pilots on the
IMSL can bid for such open positions, in accordance with their integrated seniority and the terms
and conditions of applicable CBA provisions; rather than the Carrier filling those positions by
hiring new pilots off the street. Those reciprocal, limited duration and aircraft-type defined
priority fences do not apply to the E-190 aircraft"

and

"The Award does not include proposed "conditions and restrictions" which would require
application of one carrier’s collective bargaining agreement to work performed at a carrier
covered by a different collective bargaining agreement; conditions which are contrary to existing
collective bargaining agreement provisions (e.g. proposed changes to vacancy bidding rights,
displacement provisions, domiciles, and/or training freezes/seat locks); and, conditions that
involve matters subject to negotiation (e.g. the transfer of longevity credits between collective
bargaining agreements, or tolling of recall provisions)."

and

"In the event that the NMB finds a single transportation system and then certifies a single
bargaining representative for the system-wide craft or class of pilots, applicable CBAs will
remain applicable, in accordance with their terms, until consolidated or otherwise modified by
valid mutual agreement between the affected single carrier and a certified single pilot craft or
class bargaining representative, if any."

and

"After the NMB makes its
determinations, the designated single representative and the Company must negotiate an
implementing agreement and/or revise or consolidate the applicable CBAs. Thus, these Parties
not only have the cart before the horse but also have yet to attach the wheels and seat the driver."

(we can all thank the IBT for prematurely advancing this SLI for the benefit of the majority and at the expense of the minority, but that is a debate for another thread)

In short, the CHQ CBA and F9 CBA still apply. No RAH pilot can "bid" for airbus vacancies and no F9 pilot can bid for EMB 135-175 vacancies.
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