Originally Posted by
Is offline
Well if you wanna look at things one sided and blame 3200 Skywest pilots for riding coat tails, then I guess one could say that expressjet has been riding Skywest coat tail for the last few years being the Skywest side is the only one turning a profit.
The door swings both ways. No one wants to see any more concessions, and for you to make statements about Skywest pilot group helps no one in trying to get the best for both groups. The pilot groups are being played against each other by management.
True, management is playing both. But one side is laying there doing nothing about it while the other negotiates in good faith.
Anyway, just because Skywest is making money doesn't mean we are riding your coat tails. You have very specific language that says you get what we get in scope, health benefits, and matching funds. There is no better example of true coat tail riding than that. As pilots, we operate the aircraft per the FOM that management writes just as you guys do. It's up to management to manage and make profits. Making profits or losses is not riding coat tails. Otherwise, what do you say of the quarter that the XJT side was operationally profitable? Management negotiated the loser CPAs we operate under and that's the real reason why it's been difficult to be profitable. It has nothing to do with one pilot group versus another.
Anyway, what I'm saying may not help but it is the truth. But I don't really care because I've written the Skywest pilot group off because they simply won't engage and rather just watch from the sidelines rather than help solve this whipsaw problem that our management is playing us for. There a saying the if you are not part of the solution, then you are part of the problem.
Originally Posted by
Electra
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nevets
SAPA agreed to go with whatever ASA/XJT ALPA gets in the form of 401k, health benefits, and scope (nothing to write home about since they are concessions but probably still a gain for Skywest pilots). The fact that we had to negotiate those terms for an additional 3000+ pilots, only makes it harder to negotiate improvements in those sections since it will cost Inc 7500 pilots rather than 4500.
But to answer your question, the reason why is because Skywest pilots (whether they know it or not) want to enjoy the fruits of organized labor without paying for it. The proverbial "riding of coat tails" if you will.
Many don't even know that they have language in their work rules that piggy backs off of our negotiations. Much less know what the TA says in those sections. As evidenced in this thread.
Actually, I have read that 500-some-odd page steaming turd pile you refer to as a contract agreement, and I can also read very well between the lines. Your pilots only come over retaining relative seniority if there is a direct transfer of aircraft between XJT and SkyWest. There is no language pertaining to crew rights if there is an indirect transfer. XJT returns an aircraft to it's lessor, the lessor then leases the aircraft to SkyWest, Bob's your Uncle and SkyWest is +1 aircraft with no requirement to bring over any XJT crews. How many of your aircraft are directly owned by XJT, vs. how many are leased (FROM UNITED, for example)? Moreover, how are you going to protect yourself if XJT decides to sell your airplanes to someone else who leases them back to SkyWest? Your TA has so many inane loopholes it would be funny if it wasn't so sad. I hope your MEC's put it forward as a joke and not as a serious demonstration of their efforts over the last few years... Ya'll can keep that reserve language about your pathetic number of GDO's and being available for contact from scheduling while on an overnight, too, don't worry about us riding your coattails on that! Now please quit trolling our thread, thank you.
Trust me, I'm very disappointed in the TA. I'm more disappointed in our MEC for putting it out there. But I've been disappointed in them since they decided not to fight merging all 3 pilot groups 3 years ago. With that said, it is fact that we could not get anything improved in those 3 sections because you guys decided to ride our coat tails in those sections. Inc would never agree to just keeping what we had in those sections because it would cost the whole corporation an extra 3200 pilots worth of costs. In fact, it's a drastic concession in each of those sections and yet, still better than what you have. In fact, this "joke" of a TA as a whole is better than what Skywest pilots currently works under.
Anyway, you don't understand the GDO language. The TA language is actually better but I'm sure you are an expert in pilot contracts and you really do know how immovable days work in our current contract which is what's in the TA. Also, if you actually read the TA (not contract agreement), you would've realized there is a provision to prevent the very thing you are talking about as far as transfers. But like I said, I think that is very unlikely anyway, except for maybe the 59 700/900s in a worst case scenerio. Then 590 pilots would go to Skywest with seniority and longevity. Also, if there are any furloughs and under a bilateral flow agreement, those pilots go over as well. Again, only talking about a worst case scenerio. Now, if aircraft transfer from Skywest to XJT, pilots only go if it's more than 5 aircraft in a rolling 12 months and it starts at aircraft number 5, not the first aircraft transferred. Like I said, people are negotiating on your behalf and against your interest. And you guys don't even know it. What are you going to do about it?