Originally Posted by
Scoop
I don't see what the big deal on this is. With a minimum 10 hour layover we should normally get 8 1/2 to 9 hours at the Hotel. If you get delayed - call crew tracking and have the time adjusted.
As long as the FAA sees 8 hours behind the door as legal we are good to go. If you need more time - take it! It would be nice if ALPA pushed the 8 hour issue, but I guess they are satisfied with 8 hours behind the door which by the way, we should abbreviate to 8 HBTD.
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Perhaps we should push for a clarification of the 8 hour by the FAA if there is some doubt about it. Seems DALPA thinks the FAA is good with it.
We have two separate issues here:
1. Compliance with the regulations FARs, FOM etc. Well if DAL and the FAA are both satisfied with 8 HBTD then thats fine with me.
2. Showing up for a flight well rested.
If 8 hours ain't enough - take more time. Call crew tracking and have your time adjusted.
I certainly hope the guys who are not satisfied with 8 hours take the time they need. I personally am fine with 8 hours as I normally sleep about 7 hours but everyone is different.
And for crying out loud - if you have a minimum time layover forget about ironing the shirt!
Scoop
First of all, SHOW ME where the FAA is satisfied with 8 HBTD. That's NOT what they've said. It's NOT what the regulation says. Both the FAR and the FAA clarification are clear. An 8 hour uninterrupted sleep opportunity is required. Since it's physically impossible to have an opportunity to sleep 8 hours when you are in the room for 8 hours exactly, then the mininum HBTD is something GREATER than 8 hours. How much greater is for each of us to determine based on whatever gives you the opportunity for 8 hours of sleep.
ALPA is screwing this up big time and setting somebody up for an FAR violation. That's why it's a big deal.
You are correct on one thing, though. The 10 hour minimum layover should easily provide 9+ hours behind the door under normal circumstances. Of course, we all know that circumstances are not always normal. That's when the 8 hour thing will become an issue.
But feel free to violate away. And good luck with the "ALPA told me to do it" defense. Me personally... I'm going to comply with the FAR.