Originally Posted by
RJSAviator76
Again missing the point Gloopy... If AA flies to Doha and the pax connect to Karachi, Mumbai, Bahrain, Riyadh, Seychelles, Nairobi, why on earth do you care if they fly out Doha on QR under AA codeshare?! My whole point is that I'd like to see AA B-777 do the to/from sector under codeshare agreement from AA's hubs to Doha where they'll exercise that codeshare. That means more B-777 jobs at AA.
I don't think too many pax from the US are transferring to those obscure destinations on a daily basis. Hardly near enough to fill a 777, even when you do add in the relatively small amounts of US-ME3 tourists and contractors. Especially in light of the current capacity and frequency.
We would be taking pax there to transfer to India, China, Africa and even Europe…many places that we fly direct to on our own metal and others that our partners currently fly to where we at least already get JV share of the feed on our metal to their hubs.
Any real O&D demand to ME3 cities, which is a small fraction of existing and especially projected capacity growth, would be done by ME3 and US airlines sharing that capacity on a plane for plane basis. That's fair. But that's not what ME3 wants. They want it all.
You got your panties in the twist over Milan to JFK. Understandably so... but
No buts about it. This is one of the biggest threats we're facing period. If this is allowed to stand, and even expand into other EU cities, US airlines will be in grave danger and it won't take long.
UPS and Fedex maintain a substantial presence overseas and maintain hubs abroad as well. If we enable protectionist policies, you'd really hose those two.
No we wouldn't. Its a pathetic straw man argument for you to imply we're advocating instantly eliminating any and all foreign hubs by any airline anywhere ever. We need to address and enforce open skies airlines with ME3 because they are on the war path hell bent on taking our industry over by blackening our skies with 777/380's to every major city to levels unprecidented in human history. If they win, game over for us. At least it would hose all those ALPA pilots that didn't brother up for you though, so theres that.
ME3 couldn't retaliate in the slightest, because they still need cargo. At least half of that cargo would be flown by US cargo carriers because they'd also be protected in a true open and fair skies agreement. By the way ME3 are coming for our cargo carriers too. They've just backburnered it somewhat while they launch their major assault on our passenger sector first. They don't have the planes and pilots yet to fully impliment their egotistical manidfest destiny.
So spare us the fake concern we know you don't have for US cargo pilots. And in any case, we're under no moral or ethical obligation to devistate our passenger markets just to hold up the cargo part of things. Theres a lot more pax pilots effected by this anyway.
Actually, FEIE is 98k
Great. You're making my point for me. No one says you don't have to go through the hassle of filling out returns or whatever. A large portion of your income is tax free and that is a direct recruiting tool that is largly responsibile for the pilot numbers you have there. Its time for us to look at ending that in light of the severity of the non competitive dual subsidized predatory growth response we're seeing. The absolute least we can do is stop paying and subsidizing for ME3 to destroy our international passenger industry.
Imagine this happening to you in the US.
We all face crushing tax burdens. Part of that is because we pay to defend fake royals on the other side of the world while we pay them to take our airplanes to use against us. Maybe we could lower all our tax burdens if we stopped doing that, especially if we started recouping some of the ME3 job fair perk lost revenue that those pilots aren't paying.
How's ME3 different from say Lufthansa? Or BA? Or Air France? All of these have more flights to the US than ME3.
And we already have many many many times more flights to their cities than we do or ever will to the ME3 cities. We share the flying and pax in a mostly equal proportion. Which is exactly what you don't want to see happen with ME3. Your answer is for us to just overfly their network and force non existant demand into those 3 cities to make up for them raiding our nation. Not going to happen. If US airlines fly 2 flights a day to ME3 thats all they should be allowed to fly to the US. If EU flies 100 flights a day to the US, then we can and already do fly 100 to the EU because the realistic market demand is there.
new hires don't have to be on welfare for a year or two or three before they start making a decent paycheck. And again... most of us wouldn't be here if there were jobs back home when we came here. Now that there are jobs back home, most of us want to go home and forego these "tax benefits." But it's not so easy...
There was a time when legacy airlines started out at 24 an hour, some with no health benefits. Those days are over. DL starts at 70 and is at the end of the current contract about to get raises. I think AA is pushing 80. UAL is a lower rate but pays a more generous guarantee while in training. Second year at any of them is around 100k a year. If that drives you to go on welfare then I don't think you know what welfare even is.
So in other words, we were left on our own... what would you do?
Look I don't expect you to quit, stop your income, move back and hope for the best while trying to get a flying job while you don't have one and are rapidly losing currency. I understand you have bills to pay. I get that. But the growth trend and momentum of ME3 has to be stopped or there will end up being a lot more pilots ending up in your shoes. Im in favor of hiring expats especially those that left during the lean times, as well as now to put the hurt on the airlines that are hell bent on harming US airlines.
I'd be very interested in seeing any actual data on how many US expat pilots want to come back and have active apps in.
It ain't to chase the "tax-free" lifestyle and getting chauffeured to work.
No but the tax benefits our tax code enables is a primary recruiting tool for the ME3. Its time we at least take that advantage away from them. They would have to instantly true up the pay or risk parking their EGO based fleet but at least we wouldn't be helping them as much with it.
And yes, you're right, it would be a major kick in the groin to ME3 if American pilots were hired en-masse back home... but we know that ain't gonna happen.
It could happen. Especially if our government bows down to ME3 and their lobbying dollars and allows them to pillage our networks. What they are attempting to do with their zillion to 2 flight schedule to the ME3 airports is bad enough. If they are allowed to take over EU routes its game over for us. We will end up like QANTAS. A husk of our former selves and possibly on the way out entirely. They must be stopped, and its going to take a multifaceted effort.
You also need to drop this notion that US pilots at ME3 are your enemy. You couldn't be more wrong if you tried.
I don't think that. I fully realize that folks were unemployed by furloughs or shutdowns in the lean years and needed income. Some went there, and I don't have a problem with that. I also understand that although there is a lot of retirement based hiring here now, its only started a year or so ago and not everyone that deserves to be hired has yet been hired. I'm also in favor of hiring US pilots, particularly those that left during the bad times, both because its the right thing to do by them and also because it would at least slow down the unprecidented predatory growth of ME3 carriers.
I'm not against you. Just what your employers are trying to do to us.