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Old 08-02-2015, 04:54 PM
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JamesNoBrakes
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Originally Posted by Romeo Hotel View Post
I've noticed a weird trend of dogging on that particular college in a lot of the threads. I'm just wondering if that's because of it's popularity, or if there's another reason.

The general attitude about the place makes me think it's the aviation world's version of a diploma mill or something. Am I missing something?

Currently planning on using my GI Bill there (not out of AD yet) so if anyone could let me in on the inside joke, I'd appreciate it.
Just like UND, the training is high quality and they actually hold you to standards. It's excellent training and equipment for the most part. The problem is the premium price and all the training you do (in class) that is orientated towards being a major airline pilot in the right seat of a 747. You don't go to the right seat of a 747 after graduating, in fact, for many graduates, it takes 10+ years to get to the major airline, much of that knowledge is fairly useless. There are also few employment opportunities with this knowledge outside of being an airline pilot, and this degree does NOT get you the airline pilot job, flight experience and command experience does. It's a little out there to say that the airlines don't care about the degree at all, but they are going to look at your PIC 121 turbine time first, then they'll look at your PIC multi-engine turbine time, then they'll look at your PIC time or what types of aircraft you can fly. The degree is pretty far down the list and there are many other things that make one hire-able, like aerobatic experience, or project management, or military service, maybe volunteer work, and so on.

There are basically certain "rungs" of a ladder that you have to climb in this career. Everyone has to climb the same rungs for the most part. Sometimes people think they might be able to skip a rung, but it is exceptionally rare and in many cases there is just no avenue to do so (like the company's insurance won't hire someone with hours that are too low, even though technically they hold the correct certificate, or the hang-up could be due to regulations that require a certain amount of hours). During this process, many people "branch off" to different "ladders", rather than be constrained to the airline pilot idea. There are many different kinds of pilots out there that are paid, although again, the "piloting" degree program is really intended just for the airline pilot.

The financial aspect can not be understated. If it costs $200K (which it does), you won't pay just 200K, you will pay 200K plust the loan interest that you incur over the lifetime of paying it back. Think about what those payments will be and how it will take you 5-10 years to earn more than 50K/yr in the workforce. The positive aspect is that for the foreseeable future, airline hiring will be decent. So this number could be less, but do not, DO NOT listen to ANYONE that tells you you need to get your licenses and ratings REAL FAST or NOW, because those people just want your money and nothing more. They've been saying that to every generation. Going back to that monetary amount, if it takes you a few more years to get your certificates and you don't have to pay loans, you will be better off in life than so many people. Most of us, if we had to do it again, would not take out any loans and would simply take a few more years. Think about what you can do with that kind of money, buy a house, a plane, invest, etc. It will be that much longer before you can do any of those things if you have to take out loans on the magnitude required to go to some of these schools.

These are good quality schools, they do try to teach you as best as possible, but at the end of the day there are far more important things, so spending that much money on the degree is generally not a wise idea.

All that said, if money is no object, it's a great experience, just make sure to major in something other than "professional piloting" or whatever they are calling it, so you have options if your medical status ever changes. There will be lots of people that probably badmouth the schools, but they have high standards and programs to ensure the quality of instructions. Motivation is usually the biggest issue when training college kids that are fresh out of high school. To that extent, if you are very self-motivated you can usually do well, but that usually means you can do well anywhere. Some of the cheapest schools or avenues won't be able to provide instruction that are commensurate with your level of motivation. The old "find a good part 61 instructor" line isn't always realistic, as regulations and other things change, so it can be harder to find someone that stays on top of everything and has a lot of experience. There may be no one that fits that requirement for hundreds of miles. Smaller pilot schools are often more disorganized and don't offer instruction that is of the quality of those big schools. This isn't a hard and fast rule, I'm sure there are exceptional small schools, but for the most part the bigger schools provide excellent instruction and structure. They also prepare you for airline groundschools and learning (see above), which may or may not be useful in a reasonable amount of time, but for those that aren't sure if they will hack it at an airline, these will usually give a good idea if they can/will.

Good luck.
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