Originally Posted by sailingfun

So much wrong with your post it's hard to even respond. First I suspect the 65% no vote was pretty evenly spread amongst the seniority list.
No pilots involved from the last TA are working any management positions. I know one who was involved in the last TA who has been offered management positions for the last 15 years and turned them all down.
The pension unlike UAL and USAIR was substantially retained not lost. It was converted into multiple pots of money rolled over into retirement accounts plus a PBGC payment. The average older pilot should see 75 to 80% of his pension. I am at about 80% and made a couple of bonehead investment moves. Last year the company contributed over 18% of each pilots earnings to their retirement plan. Young pilots should exceed the old plan with that level of contribution. The current plan is in each pilots own name. I would not take the old plan back if offered.
Throwing a bone is a relative term. Managements current table position would have us the highest compensated pilots in the US in the passenger industry. If you count PS we would exceed UPS and Fedex. It appears they have drawn a line about 10% above are nearest competitor with PS included and are not going above that overall number.
Most pilots seem to feel we are in the ballpark pay wise but object to having to get a sick note for sick calls after using 100 hours of sick leave in the previous 12 months and a provision to include all management compensation as a cost when calculating PS instead of excluding equity based money.
The current company proposal would would raise pilot pay in hard money 21.1% on 1 JAN 17. There would be another 1% soft money for a total of about a 22% increase. Profit sharing would take somewhere around a 2 to 2.5% hit assuming management doubled their equity compensation however we would recover about that amount with a shift in the pilot verses non cons distribution of the total pool. By 1 Jan 18 pilots would see a 25% increase in pay.
All of the above are using management table position. I expect the end product to be better.