Originally Posted by
Feng
I think you're the only ones counting that retro check, because I doubt anyone cares.
The only thing that matters is what the mediators, arbitrators, the members of NMB, and the president thinks.
Good luck though.
Feng, you use reasonable logic, so let's use some logic here...After a TA is reached, and a new payscale is put in place. What is the airline obligated to do under RLA obligation for those employees that worked under an expired contract?
Retroactive pay (as it relates to the new payscale). Who would have to pay?
The company. So why do you thinks it's pilot's that are the only party concerned about the paying out of lump sums of money? Spirit WILL have to pay the difference and though it may be subject to a payment plan, it will cost the airline-so it is a planned expense that is being taken into account. Why would you think otherwise?
Originally Posted by
Feng
Yeah all that, but low labor cost is still one of the, if not the core principal of an ULCC business. Once there's a contract revenue will increase? What?
I'm not managing anything. In fact I couldn't care less how this turn out, though I do enjoy being right
Last I checked this is an open forum for discussing industry topics. That's precisely what I'm doing. Talking about what I think will happen with your contract. You certainly have an opinion on this, though I think it's completely asinine. I'm just here to express mine.
1) You misunderstand, the term ULCC is slang. The term budget carrier/ULCC/LCC etc have always related to the customer's purchasing power. Southwest airlines was the first 'low cost carrier'...but have they operated their business around your alleged core principal of "low labor cost"? Perspective; Retail shops like the Dollar Tree& The dollar store are budget suppliers that cater to consumers with optional or decreased buying power...does that mean they pay their employees less than minimum wage or less than a comparable convenience store employee? Of course not. The flaw in your logic may be that you haven't realized that historical FACT.
2) Don't infantilize yourself by mentioning how little you could care less about this outcome. It's inflammatory (which you have every right to be), but more importantly, it negates the point you've tried to make. Are you an adult pilot? Do you fly for a living? If so this outcome will affect you. Regardless of the outcome, this NMB will set a precedent for future labor disputes (the same way past NMB's have set legal precedent). What is truly asinine is that you have come to a forum that is filled with uncertainty and you try to make a point with sarcasm and cynicism. Do you realize that? Guys telling you to go away are no match to the self-inflicted negation of your own attitude. Really is weird.
Originally Posted by
Feng
And to Qotsa, just because you keep saying it, does not make it any truer. Full retro is simply not industry standard. In just about ANY industry. It sometimes happens, more likely when the negotiations were short and the amounts are small, but most don't for anybody. But keep counting though and that $1.5 million dollar check will be in the mail for everybody in about 7 years.
Once again, you are completely wrong in this sentiment. It is void of any historical fact. First off, not every industry falls under the provision of the RLA. A coal miner's labor dispute isn't an RLA labor dispute. Additionally, just because a past TA included wording for a release of liability of a retro check, does not mean retroactive pay isn't dispensed. The TA will address this issue in addition to the NMB prior to the TA. Secondly, where are you getting your information from? It definitely seems that you are making your reply up out of thin air. "The amounts were small"-no, lump sum checks of thousands of dollars are pretty normal. To quote Walter Sobchak, "you're out of your element".
Originally Posted by
Feng
Qotsa
In my opinion, as long as the nmb doesn't conclude that the company is unfairly forcing you guys to work for an unreasonably low market rate, they simply will not allow a strike no matter how long this drags on. I have a hard time seeing them allowing it, especially if Spirit offers a blended of Allegiant, Frontier, JetBlue..etc rates, which in itself is probably a substantial raise.
If you're allowed to strike GREAT ON YA, go get that $$$. I simply don't see that happening. If nothing terrible happens, in 10 years, Legacy NB CA could have rates of $350/hr and JetBlue at $310/hr. You'll still be topped out at ~$190 while refusing the company's offer of $315/hr because it's not "industry standard"
Yeah here we go, you are clearly just pulling this stuff out your ground-hole. The RLA has established a timeline. It isn't upto the NMB to determine if a strike is allowed or not. They just report to the President what the labor situation is and their findings to prevent a disservice to the American people. The labor group will be allowed to strike so long as it respects the timeline of the RLA. I highly suggest you read...anything...just read anything, because the thought of you being a functional and coherent adult pilot (even at COMM/CFI level) is concerning. "Good moral character" suggests support of a fellow pilot group from jump-seating to NMBs.So why troll pilots that are going through a rough patch under the guise of offering an opinion? Dumb, plain old dumb. If I didn't know any better, I'd say your content suggests your a jealous flight attendant.
Damn the fight is on!