Originally Posted by
89Pistons
But have you flown LHR un-augmented? I have.
1) Math. Hawaii is barely 5 hours. EWR-LHR is 2.5 to 3 hours LONGER.
2) LAX-HNL is all daylight. EWR-LHR isn't. The HNL-LAX red eye is all dark but often go's under 5 hours.
3) You don't spend and hour and a half to get to the hotel in HNL like you do in LHR.
4) Getting in and out of LAX and HNL is much free flowing and getting out of EWR and LHR.
5) On EWR-LHR you're crossing twice as many time zones as you do LAX-HNL.
6) There's many more reasons why but I have to go commute soon.
I've done a lot of international flying unaugmented in my career. I don't find LHR to be particularly challenging, especially in a 787 with all of its automation; YMMV.
A typical LHR arrival would be a bit of holding then longazz vectors to final with a constant rate descent … 700 FPM was ballpark IIRC; 500-600 FPM to start would keep you safe. In tight trail of the plane in front of you where he's touching down when you're 500 ft AGL. Around that time, you'd get landing clearance. Rinse, repeat.
As far as unaugmented EWR-LHR flights, LCAL used to do the eastbound leg unaugmented. This wouldn't be anything new.
1) At what mach?
I just looked at my last two LAX-HNL-LAX IDs and all four flights were over 5 hrs. But they're a couple hours shorter than the unaugmented HNL-DEN flights which I've also flown.
A 787 is going to cruise at a higher mach than a 756 and a 777 so the flight time will be shorter.
I rarely flew HNL-LAX under 5 hrs in the 777; what plane were you flying that would do it under 5 on a regular basis?
2) LHR-EWR is also all daylight. Let's not get wrapped around the axle about day vs night because both IDs have all day and all night legs.
3) I usually used that bus ride to the hotel to sleep and the bus ride to LHR to download/look at the flight plan. What do you do on the bus ride?
4) How many times have you flown in/out of LHR? How many flights did it take for you to be fully familiar with LHR?
As for EWR, I'd hope that anyone based in EWR would be familiar with the airport.
5) I've never been sensitive to time zone changes so I'm not sure what point you're trying to make here.
I think you're grossly overestimating how junior EWR 787 would go if there were unaugmented Atlantic crossings.