Originally Posted by ocskyguy

Okay. Once again I will jump into the fray...


1) FO/FO pairings. No way around it. We have two FOs for every Captain. Mathematically impossible to get away from the FO/FO pairing. And, if you are paying attention, you should be able to perform the duties from either seat. And, (at least in my checkrides), I give some leniency for the FO that is in the left seat. More than I would give a Captain.

It’s not impossible to do. It would require a time and money investment from the company. FO/FO pairings would still happen but for the MV and LOE they would be paired up with captain sim instructor or captain seat support that was not in the OPT program.

2) OPT/OPT pairings. Not supposed to happen. Been up this road multiple times with the girls who schedule. If you find yourself in one, see me. I will fix it.

Shouldn’t happen but still does.


3) Over the top LOE scenarios? Really? You can't reason your way through a subtle loss of hydraulics? There is never going to be a checklist for all possibilities (see Ocskyguy's Rule Number 1). You need to have sufficient system understanding to reason your way through a malfunction. This is not, and never will be Delta. We hand you the keys to the jet and expect you to have enough understanding to think your way through a problem when you have little or no support from the Brain Trust at the other end of the ACARS. If you want your hand held 24/7 while you are at work, you need to be looking for another job.

There is such a disconnect between you guys and line flying. A simple hydraulic issue? That requires a completely unrealistic scenario to come to fruition? I’m not saying it’s not a good learning experience. I think it’s a great learning experience to include in one of the first look days. On a checkride, come on. LOE flights are suppose to be ASAP driven and a normal line flight. We shut down engines the flight before on the MV, we really need to be shutting down more?You’re right about one thing though, this isn’t Delta. Delta has figured out how to create a training program that takes pilots with less credentials then most of our new hires, train them, keep their metal and pax safe, and not have ridiculous OPT rates. Our job is unique, but making AQP a PITA does nothing to help us with our line flying.

4) I call TOTAL BULL******. We never force a new hire to a gate when they are not ready. EVER! If you are in a CQ or an Upgrade, it is different. Those events are covered by the CBA that your union agreed to. You go to the gate. If it is unsuccessful, you will be given extra training and another go, or two, or three. The number of pilots who have been asked to resign because of training failures in the last several years can be counted on one hand.

Say what you will, but I have first hand experience with this issue. Maybe you don’t, but others do. Finally, if you believe the CBA handcuffs you in keeping failures down, bring that issue to the union. I’m sure they’re just as interested in fixing the AQP problem as you are.

5) Equally, I call Bull******. The majority of pilots in OPT are there because of failures on a PV or MPV (neither is a PRIA reportable event). So, only us and them know. And, a great majority of them are there for a specific event, which is the V1 cut, resulting in a crash. So, I ask you, if you know deep down inside that a real V1 engine failure may kill you and the rest of the crew because you are unable to demonstrate your skill in the simulator, would you not want extra training to help you improve on your skill and hopefully, when the bad day does come you get to live?

If someone is struggling with a V1 cut it’s not happening on MV day. That’s going to be evident from their first look. Sure you’ll have an outlier here or there that nails their first look and then has a bad MV, but those are in the minority. So my question is why are they being sent to the MV instead of receiving an additional sim session to practice the maneuver? Yeah...yeah...yeah...the union and CBA prevent that...got it...

The MV and PV may not be PRIA reportable but they still are asked about on applications. You could lie about failing one of these checks but then risk losing your job if it ever gets discovered. It also doesn’t take a rocket scientist to look at a PRIA report and see that an applicant had two LOEs in a year, must of failed an MV or PV.

So no, it is a big deal if a MV or PV failure occurs as that has to be explained on ever job application.

If you are going to throw rocks, have the balls to identify yourself and take it to the people who can address your concerns. I am proud of our training department. We work damn hard at trying to keep you alive...

I just gave you some my concerns. Do you believe you handled my constructive criticism well? Well enough for me to believe that I could take that to those in charge, including yourself? I’m not hiding behind a screen name. You can probably figure out who I am with a little detective work. I’m not getting personal or bashing specific people or their personal on here like some of these trolls. I’m bringing real issues to you and you’re honestly not handling them that well. Instead of objectively looking at the training department and saying ok, these complaints might have some substance, I should investigate deeper. You instead take it as a personal attack and shut down.

Finally it’s not your job to keep us alive. That comes down to us. No scenario you give us in the box is going to prepare us for dropping a 74 into central Africa and all the headaches associated with. We learn that on the line. A difficult AQP program with a high failure rate doesn’t keep us safer out their, it does the opposite. The pilot group is so worried about busting checkrides, getting black marks on their record, and losing their job they trying to limit their exposure to the training department anyway they can.

If you take away one thing from this post, I’m not trying to throw stones, or personally attack you or anyone in the training department. You guys have a tough job. I get it. I’m trying to point out my issues with the program tha many seem to share. It’s not personal, don’t take it that way.