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Old 11-20-2018, 11:01 AM
  #3564  
Aero1900
Gets Weekends Off
 
Joined APC: Nov 2012
Position: 1900D CA
Posts: 3,397
Default We've been played

Here's the way I see it right now:


We have simply been outplayed by Indigo, Frontier, the NMB and the system in general.



The reality is that the NMB sees us differently from the legacies. And maybe they are right to a degree. Low cost airlines around the world pay their pilots less than the big, international legacy airlines. SouthWest has broken that chain, but they really aren't a low cost carrier anymore and it took them 30 years to get to industry leading. They are basically an 'economy only' legacy. They aint cheap anymore.



First, I feel that the company has an awful lot to use to make their case that they can't and wont pay us on par with the big boys. The NMB sees a roughly 45 to 50% pay raise and thinks its a killer deal. If we vote no, don't expect to see a drop of sympathy or help from the NMB. Maybe we don't need their help, I don't really know? But I can guarantee you, they won't be helping us out if we vote no.


Second, we just weren't going to do all that much better. Lets be honest, we were never going to get to UAL/DAL rates. So the reality is the best we could probably ever hope for is to maybe split the difference between Spirits rates and the legacy rates, and that's a stretch. Therefore, the best we could get would be $10/ hour higher, maybe $15. Unfortunately, we would be sacrificing a huge raise for an undetermined period of time to hopefully eek out a few more bucks an hour. That may or may not be worth it, its simply impossible to know.


Third, if we vote it down and send the NC back to the table, the company will simply shuffle money around to make the deal look better to us. Maybe they will add a little bit to the pot, but not much. If we send it back, we need to have a very unified reason why. I don't even know that we have that? Some guys are mad about PBS, some are mad about hourly rates and some are mad about LTD. We can't vote it down and not have a unified reason and demands. What the heck is the NC supposed to do with that? The company could fix our pay rates while taking something else away. These guys aren't stupid, and they aren't just going to give up more money for nothing in exchange. You want $250 an hour? Sure, just give up your 5 hour a day vacation... Heck, the company probably already has a plan if we vote it down. They already know what to move around to make it look better.



Lastly, I believe that this was going to be one of the most difficult section 6 negotiations ever. We were soooo far behind its not even funny, and we are negotiating against the toughest boys in the industry. Frontier has converted into a ULCC, like it or not. Anyone hired in the past 5 years knew this. Anyone here longer than 5 years has had their company change business models, something that is simply out of your control. In addition, Indigo is simply a cold hearted group of private equity, "profit over people" group of assholz. This just wasn't going to go well for us.


Now, that being said, I don't think we are totally screwed here either. This TA is subpar, no doubt. But it brings us way way closer to industry standard, and puts us in a much better position going forward. We are currently an statistical outlier, and if this is voted in, we will be in the pattern, albeit the bottom end of it. Isn't that what our lanyards said? Bring us into the pattern. Not, bring us to the top of the industry?


This deal provides big pay raises, and a substantially improved retirement contribution system. While we should all be disappointed, this is not a total garbage contract either.




FLAME AWAY!!!

I want to see how ****ed off every one gets at me. We all know this suckers getting voted in anyhow. Pilots cant resist money. Indigo simply outplayed us. The only question is if this passes by more than 60%
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