True. I was talking about in years when the S&P is in the red. Misunderstood that I meant long term average.

If if there’s a better alternative to it let’s hear about it.

What I don’t understand the pushback to a plan that will essentially give us a 9% raise (in addition to a raise in pay rates) but masked in a retirement vehicle that is in addition to our 401k. While our 401k is maxed, anymore DC is fruitless, so we need something additional. While not as good as 401k rules, I’ve not seen where there is something that not only is available but what can be negotiated due to tax write offs for Delta on the MBCBP.

We are are at the limits. The MBCBP May be all we have available that works for both sides and is negotiable.