Drum, I understand you're pessimistic, and for good reason, but we have no idea what they are asking. You may well be right that the company is asking for certain concessions (scope, per day credit, pay rates, etc) and I would be against those.

All I'm saying is; reducing the ALV is not a concession. It makes us less productive, and therefore is a concession to the company. I understand it hurts the max-credit-window guys, but to the pilot group and the profession, it's a win.

The only reason it's also a win to the company today, is their overall payroll is reduced even though their cost per pilot is increased.