Originally Posted by RJSAviator76

Lew, are you a gambling man? It sounds to me like you are. You are arguing academics. I'm arguing reality. The reality is that everything you're suggesting had its place prior to Delta signing off on their contract and setting the market. Alaska pilots are the ones who shat the bed, but Delta pilots then wallowed and spread it all over the room with help of UAL and American pilots.

At what point does this become an exercise of diminishing returns to you, especially considering the obstacles the RLA process presents us? In other words, do you seriously think that had our NC and SWAPA told the NMB we are rejecting their compensation offer (this apparently has the hallmark of Beebe - leading pay + 1%), and bring on the ice, we wouldn't have problems in our ranks, especially given the knowns of the where the market now was?

Forget the NMB and the whole ice age, you lose the membership if your demands become 'unreasonable.' Just a small example... WB pay. Everyone here has been squawking about wanting WB pay because we make more takeoffs and landings than everyone else, you know the arguments. The reality sets in when at other carriers maybe a third of the pilot group is actually getting WB pay, yet here, some are willing to burn the place down over it not covering the entire pilot group. I think it makes it a great negotiating point, but I know the answer is somewhere in the middle, especially now that the market has been established. How long do we deprive the pilot group of gains because we are seeking to overturn the market set by our competitors? How about public support? Even more importantly, how about support from home and the family? How long does Karen at home support us especially if she has girlfriends whose hubbies fly for competitors? How long does that support last?

We can argue academics all day long, but this is no difference than arguing strict spreadsheet, and the reason being - the spreadsheet fails to account for the human aspect. Gordon Bethune talks about this in his book From Worst to First when he talks about accountants deciding how to cut costs at a pizza joint... they'll make it will look fantastic on the spreadsheet, but the reality will smack them in the face because no one wants to eat a cardboard box. That's the argument we're having here. You're simply failing to account for human factors considering that the market has been set by our peers. Prior to Delta and the legacy carriers accepting what they did? I agree with you 200%.