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Old 02-13-2009 | 12:44 PM
  #20  
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Luckydawg
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Joined: Feb 2007
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From: -400 FO
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Fatty,

The ATR accident was an uncommanded aileron reversal due to ice build up beyond the reach of the (wing) boots, not tail. The ATR had transversal boots instead of annual boots. The way the system worked lured you into a false sense of security that you had an anit-ice system and not a de-ice system.

Changes were made to the physical boot itself. They were elongated. Recovery procedures were changed. Heavy ice, get out of it, no auto pilot and if you had an un-commanded roll you were to add flaps to increase the chamber of the wing.

While on approach to STL one evening in conditions much like BUF, an ATR crew (friend and coworker) almost went in on about a 4 mile final. They had just selected flaps and got a tail stall. Recovered as in above posts, with retracting flaps up, etc. Ironically this is just the opposite of a stall recovery as well as the opposite of un-commanded roll reversal. (Lots to think about!)

Since moving to turbojets, my experience is that the airflow and ramrise temperature is much different to the characteristics of icing. You still have to worry about icing but not nearly as much. I have been in icing conditions that were to me in a turboprop moderate to severe with a DC9 in front and behind calling a trace of ice. I've seen just the opposite when I'm in a jet seeing a trace with turbo-props calling much greater.

Not saying what Colgan flight encountered but it sure seems as if they had a tail stall especially after hearing (the NTSB) that they just selected Flaps 15 and started to oscillate in both pitch and roll axis. Sounds like they attempted to retract flaps and gear but it was too late.

Thoughts and prayers to the Colgan family, crew and passengers aboard.
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