Originally Posted by
atr42flyer
welcome to our world! no wonder everyone thinks express jet pilots are snobs. you just clarified it perfectly for me.
but hey your living the dream right!
Because we are used to providing a good product?
Originally Posted by
Slaphappy
And people wonder why expressjet has the highest costs in the industry and headed towards bankruptcy.
We are more expensive because of ACARS, PDCs, cleaners, washers, etc?
Originally Posted by
Tumbleweed
I had heard Express got the United contract for essentially a loss (less than what Mesa was getting). I might be wrong though. Anyway, perhaps that is why a lot of those perks are being left out compared to what services are rendered by CAL.
Can you provide a source?
Originally Posted by
Slaphappy
If that were true then XJT wouldn't be taking a loss to for flying at the same rate skywest could have done it for a profit.
And the reason why the CAL CPA is not profitable yet is because XJT was forced to sign the CPA that SKW negotiated with CAL using SKW pilot costs, which are 16% lower than XJT's, according to your CEO.
Originally Posted by
Slaphappy
Also let's all please drop the "Quality product" crap, everyone here flys rjs for a major airline, that is the product. No regional is any better than the rest just cheaper. An erj flown by XJT in united colors is no different than a erj flown by transtates in united colors, the only difference is the profit margin.
So the memory foam seats and XM radio in XJT aircraft don't provide a quality product?
Originally Posted by
Slaphappy
First of all XJT has been losing money for the past two years and will continue to lose money. It doesn't matter if you're getting "slightly" more money because it still doesn't help your ultra high costs.
XJT reported a profit today.
Originally Posted by
Slaphappy
2nd. I, like the MAJORITY of skywest are VERY Happy with our current situtation and shows because that last alpa drive was frimly rejected by over 60%. We have 0 pilots on furlough and are crediting almost 90 hours a month, life is good for skywest pilots.
And you forgot to mention that you are riding coat tails as well.
Originally Posted by
Slaphappy
Lastly you can poke fun at us for having 70 seaters but as you've seen in the last two years your company has shrunk because they are still set on only flying an obsolete airplane, and for your information we do get paid more to fly the 70 seaters than the 50 seaters.
We're all RJ pilots and this is an entry level job.
How much more? Is it 5% more? Do you get paid 50 seat rates for vacation, sick time, training, or any other time you get paid for when not flying?
If we are all RJ pilots and this is an entry level job then should I assume you don't want any pay raises?
Originally Posted by
Slaphappy
It is up to the union to create the desire to want to have a union voted it. Other airlines did it because people wanted it in. I would say only about 10% of the people didn't care. The fact is alpa was and still isn't wanted at skywest and with any luck will never be tried again.
Well you management didn't play fair either. It took a federal judge to slap them with an injunction.
Originally Posted by
Slaphappy
the 70 seaters were coming regardless i'm just happy we were able to give united such a good deal that all 65 of the 70 seaters up for grabs came to us. I know the whole "deal me an ace" thing and if that is what it took to make sure WE got it and not another airlines then I say we did the right thing.
Are you talking about the deal to fly 70 seaters for 50 seat rates?
Originally Posted by
rickair7777
No we are not benefiting from every union carrier. A few yes, but not mesa, colgan, TSA, gojet, 9E, etc, etc.
Most union regional pilots just pay their dues and get raped anyway by their MEC, the upper 15% of their own list, alpa national, and management. But they get a cool magazine...
Collectively, even considering those you mentioned, you benefit from ALPA as a whole. Even the Mesa pilots don't get raped by their MEC. Do you honestly beleive that things would be better if there was no union at Mesa? Anyways, if members don't like their MEC, national officers, or the magazine, they have a way to change them.
Originally Posted by
Airsupport
You may have a higher hourly rate but in the end I am able to keep more money. And that's with a 1999 contract. I hope you all get a contract soon or this is only the beginning of what skywest has in store for its people.
First of all, its not all about hourly rate. Work rules play a big role. The way we should look at it is, how much does your contract allow you to make compared to how many block hours you flew. The better contracts allow pilots to fly little and paid a lot and thus making the "effective" hourly rate much higher than the actual hourly rate. I will take SKW CEOs word for it and assume that their pilots get 16% less than XJT pilots.
By the way, SKW pilots do NOT have a contract and wont get one soon either.
Originally Posted by
JDFlyer
Bluntly and simply, the vast majority of pilots at Skywest do not want ALPO or Teamsters or any other national union because the majority of us feel we have a VERY GOOD working relationship with our management team. The vast majority of the time, they don't abuse us, we don't abuse them - guess what? It works for us very, very well. (Yes, there are exceptions. No company is perfect, Skywest included. TonyWilliams and a handful on others on these forums would be glad to give details to anyone interested)
Just because you have a national union does NOT mean you don't have good relations with your management. XJT is the perfect example of that. I could have said the same exact things about abuse at XJT as you said about SKW. At XJT, it works very very well and yes there are exceptions here as well. Except that people don't have to pay out of pocket to get their jobs back like DD had to and people get an honest hearing at the Training Review Board before being terminated instead of what happened to TW.
[quote=JDFlyer;768023]Intentionally, I don't fly for an ALPO carrier, just as I am sure many of you, intentionally, don't fly for a non-ALPO carrier. Also intentionally, my next airline job will also NOT be at an ALPO carrier.[/qoute]
I can respect that on a certain level. But that doesn't mean you don't ride the coat tails.
Originally Posted by
JDFlyer
No kool-aid drinking here, just exercising my freedom of choice. Isn't America great, we all have the freedom of choice to work where and for whom we want?
Curious, the airline you worked for voted in ALPA, would you choose to quit?
Originally Posted by
JDFlyer
Ha ha! I never said I don't appreciate or like ALPO. I thank them every day, especially the MECs at Delta and United who gave me my job flying 70 and 50 seat CRJs around this great country.
And what are the pilots at your airline doing to negotiate a higher pay rate in work rules for those 70 and 50 seat CRJs?
Originally Posted by
JDFlyer
Now on to answering your questions. You took the time to write them, I'll take the time to answer them.
1. Take the pay cut. Why? Because I trust Skywest's management team to make sound financial decisions. A great number of people other than pilots support themselves and their families by working at Skywest. When corporate cash outflow exceeds cash inflow, there are bigger problems at issue. In my opinion, Unions that only negotiate pay raises and never pay cuts, deserve exactly what they get. If I did not trust Skywest's management team I should (1) either quit working for Skywest, (2) apply for a management job in St. George.
ALPA has negotiated both pay raises and pay cuts. What is your point?
[quote=JDFlyer;768062]2. I don't pretend to believe my or your management has any control over or influence with the health care industry. Health insurance executives, pharmaceutical executives, trial lawyers, 1200 calorie hamburgers, big tobacco, etc., etc. are the cause of health care costs, NOT Skywests management team.[/qoute]
No, but SKW management does have control on how much of those expenses to pass to their employees. ALPA also has the ability to try and to do something about things that can be legislated like health insurance taxes, etc.
Originally Posted by
JDFlyer
3. Skywest does not fire pilots for INITIALLY losing their medical. If I lose it and can't get it back due to health reasons beyond my control, I should go get a job in another industry. Do you want to put your wife and kids on my aircraft if my heart decides it want to start skipping every third beat, for example?
And ALPA cannot get you a medical if you don't qualify under the FARs. I don't think that is was the poster's point. His point was that ALPA helps streamline the process to get your medical back if you qualify. ALPA becomes your advocate, handler, lawyer, advisor, etc when it comes to all things dealing with your medical. The FAA makes the final determination though.
Originally Posted by
JDFlyer
4. Lobbyists are one of the greatest problems with our nation. In my opinion they should all be banned from Washington.
I couldn't agree with you more. In fact, that is why I'm 110% for the FairTax. But until the rules of the game or the game itself is changed, its best to play within the rules to win. And ALPA does that on behalf of ALL airline pilots.
Originally Posted by
JDFlyer
5. In fact, Skywest is one of the most expensive UAEX carriers. I am not worried about an alter ego carrier, because United, Delta, and Airtran hire us for the consistently high quality of service we provide. I care deeply about my job and the service I provide to each and every external and internal customer. Skywest takes care of me, and I work very hard to take care of Skywest.
An alter ego carrier? You are the alter ego carrier!
And if SKW is hired because of their high quality, then why didn't SKW get the DAL LAX or UAL ORD flying? I'm not disagreeing with you, just wondering. I beleive that it depends on a lot of things, including quality and price.
Originally Posted by
JDFlyer
6. I don't know what kind of work rules we would have if it were not for ALPO. Because the way I look at it, my work rules at Skywest are vastly superior to the work rules at just about every other ALPO regional out there. Like I said, Skywest takes care of me, and I work very hard to take care of Skywest.
And many of your work rules you get because SKW management gives them to you to keep up with the other regionals. They seem to always bring you back up to just above industry average.
Originally Posted by
JDFlyer
And finally, don't get me wrong, I am not anti pilot union, I am strongly in favor of in-house pilot representation at Skywest. I hopefully will soon be joining the in-house union at Southwest, SWAPA.
If you like ALPA, more power to you. For me the choice is easy, JUST SAY NO, IT IS ALPO!!!
I can respect that also. But ALPA has made this profession better, not just one pilot group better.