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-   -   50 Seat Viability (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/air-wisconsin/128834-50-seat-viability.html)

domino 04-27-2020 08:40 PM


Originally Posted by flightlessbirds (Post 3040899)
Doubtful. It will shed more light on his scope maneuvers and posturing for both that and more government trough money. They don’t have any idea what the demand curve will look like on the other side of this.

ALPA sent out the notice tonight about the elimination of the 757 fleet. 50 seaters are not going to survive. Plan accordingly

point80 04-27-2020 09:37 PM


Originally Posted by domino (Post 3043541)
ALPA sent out the notice tonight about the elimination of the 757 fleet. 50 seaters are not going to survive. Plan accordingly

Shhhh....
If nobody says it. It wont happen....

DarkSideMoon 04-27-2020 11:37 PM


Originally Posted by Excargodog (Post 3043479)
https://i.ibb.co/25JTZ4J/8-DBB0-DF4-...CDEC4-FE27.jpg




Uh.... 128,000 isn’t Avogadro’s number or anything, but by no stretch of the imagination is it statistically insignificant. And today was the highest number in three weeks. The trend is definitely your friend.

Yeah, on days that previously had high numbers of travelers as well. It’s natural for there to be some ebb and flow, there were jumps of up to 25% last year too. Call me back when it routinely breaks more than 10% of what we were at a year ago and I’ll believe there’s some bona fide signs of life rather than normal day to day variation.

Da Vinci 04-28-2020 03:33 AM


Originally Posted by domino (Post 3043541)
ALPA sent out the notice tonight about the elimination of the 757 fleet. 50 seaters are not going to survive. Plan accordingly

where are you seeing this email?

AZwiz 04-28-2020 03:48 AM


Originally Posted by domino (Post 3043541)
ALPA sent out the notice tonight about the elimination of the 757 fleet. 50 seaters are not going to survive. Plan accordingly

That's not what the e-mail said...

Itsajob 04-28-2020 05:39 AM

The company issued a NPDM is all that has been announced. It is a notice for proposed decision making that is required by the United pilots contract before they make big adjustments to fleet staffing levels. When they opened DEN and ORD 787 bases they issued these. All it does is provide notification that they are looking to make changes. Once they decide what they want to do, they announce their plan and then in good times it is followed by a vacancy bid, and in bad it is followed by a displacement bid. Since 50 seat flying doesn’t fall under our contract, I don’t know of any reporting requirement. As long as it complies with our scope language, they can expand or eliminate that flying with no notification requirement to United pilots.

MasterOfPuppets 04-28-2020 09:01 AM


Originally Posted by domino (Post 3043541)
ALPA sent out the notice tonight about the elimination of the 757 fleet. 50 seaters are not going to survive. Plan accordingly


ok now it’s obvious you don’t work for United.....either that or you can’t read. Nowhere in the email did it say anything about the 756 fleet being eliminated. You need to give it up. I’m pretty sure everyone on APC knows you for the troll that you are.

Turbosina 05-04-2020 05:17 PM


Originally Posted by MasterOfPuppets (Post 3043875)
ok now it’s obvious you don’t work for United.....either that or you can’t read. Nowhere in the email did it say anything about the 756 fleet being eliminated. You need to give it up. I’m pretty sure everyone on APC knows you for the troll that you are.

He claims to be a Skywest new hire, but my guess is he's a student pilot with 5 hours. If he does indeed work at Skywest, all I can say is that idiots like him are the .001% that every airline has, that somehow slipped through the cracks.

He does this on every thread, BTW. Delta, American, even GoJet.

Meow1215 05-07-2020 05:20 PM


Originally Posted by domino (Post 3043541)
ALPA sent out the notice tonight about the elimination of the 757 fleet. 50 seaters are not going to survive. Plan accordingly

Being the black cloud of Skywest not enough?

piloto2 05-13-2020 05:26 PM


Originally Posted by domino (Post 3043541)
ALPA sent out the notice tonight about the elimination of the 757 fleet. 50 seaters are not going to survive. Plan accordingly

https://viewfromthewing.com/american...LMf_dF8pJHR6mQ

Da Vinci 05-21-2020 05:39 AM

More like “50 seat volatility”

Papa Bear 05-21-2020 07:09 PM

If I have a single type rating for a 50 seater RJ Im filling out applications for the truck driving school.

idlethrust 05-22-2020 07:28 AM


Originally Posted by Papa Bear (Post 3061559)
If I have a single type rating for a 50 seater RJ Im filling out applications for the truck driving school.

I have my CDL
working a driving job now during this downturn . It’s very flexible and if I work 5 days a week it’s 12-1500 bucks .
Working this , with the 30 hr line , in between pto and dropping lines I don’t want I’m doing just fine and will be for the next few months . If I get the F word come October I’ll be driving full time until the industry rebounds .
Got to have a plan b and know how to do something different

Escargot 04-02-2021 04:06 AM

Maybe, just maybe there's a future in 50 seater...
ZeroAvia

TransWorld 04-02-2021 11:54 AM


Originally Posted by Escargot (Post 3215079)
Maybe, just maybe there's a future in 50 seater...
ZeroAvia

Where does the hydrogen originate? What energy source is used to create the hydrogen?

I realize the average person in the general public says milk comes from a store...

Escargot 04-02-2021 06:25 PM


Originally Posted by TransWorld (Post 3215363)
Where does the hydrogen originate? What energy source is used to create the hydrogen?

I realize the average person in the general public says milk comes from a store...

hydrogen is easy you come by. Electrolysis would be the easiest way. Turning that into a power cell is a different story. Lithium batteries are already the Hindenburg of modern times. Imagine what a runaway hydrogen cell with enough power to move a transport category aircraft must be like... well the Hindenburg, really.

Excargodog 04-02-2021 06:30 PM


Originally Posted by Escargot (Post 3215608)
hydrogen is easy you come by. Electrolysis would be the easiest way. Turning that into a power cell is a different story. Lithium batteries are already the Hindenburg of modern times. Imagine what a runaway hydrogen cell with enough power to move a transport category aircraft must be like... well the Hindenburg, really.

He asked what ENERGY SOURCE is used to create the Hydrogen.

TransWorld 04-02-2021 07:56 PM


Originally Posted by Excargodog (Post 3215613)
He asked what ENERGY SOURCE is used to create the Hydrogen.

Exactly.

Electrolysis is applying current through water to make hydrogen and oxygen. Last time I heard, that current comes from Coal, Natural Gas, and Nuclear power plants. To lesser extents from Hydroelectric, intermittently from Solar, and intermittently from Wind.

Nothing is free.

Escargot 04-26-2021 05:20 PM

Here we go....
The Fall Of All-Economy 50 Seater Regional Jets In New York

idlethrust 04-26-2021 07:12 PM


Originally Posted by Escargot (Post 3227025)

The domino effect will be interesting. I knew it was only a matter of time.

TransWorld 04-27-2021 10:30 AM

Good insight.

ninerdriver 04-29-2021 04:02 AM


Originally Posted by Escargot (Post 3227025)

Eh. UA is saying it's pulling its 145s from EWR because it's trying to get business travelers from small cities to fly to EWR instead of LGA. It'll realize that won't work, and then it'll back out of that statement.

AA is pulling their 50-seaters from NYC because it's giving up on NYC. Totally different.

flynd94 04-29-2021 05:30 AM


Originally Posted by ninerdriver (Post 3228094)
Eh. UA is saying it's pulling its 145s from EWR because it's trying to get business travelers from small cities to fly to EWR instead of LGA. It'll realize that won't work, and then it'll back out of that statement.

AA is pulling their 50-seaters from NYC because it's giving up on NYC. Totally different.

And most of those SINGLE CLASS 50 seaters are being replaced by the 550/170/175 or even 319/737-7.

TransWorld 04-29-2021 08:12 AM


Originally Posted by flynd94 (Post 3228126)
And most of those SINGLE CLASS 50 seaters are being replaced by the 550/170/175 or even 319/737-7.

I predict more and more A220-100 and A220-300 will be in the works for more and more airlines. The jump from 76 seats to much bigger (like the 160 seat B737-800) seems like too big a jump.

I don’t see Airbus pushing to sell more new A319 while those lines are filled with A321 orders and B737-700 are not being sold with the -800 and Max being pushed (I take the long view that Maxs will be accepted again).

The A319 and B737-700 that are flying are aging out. A 100 seat and 120 seat option just seems to fit a need between 76 and 160.

Flydafe 04-29-2021 08:39 AM


Originally Posted by TransWorld (Post 3228206)
I predict more and more A220-100 and A220-300 will be in the works for more and more airlines. The jump from 76 seats to much bigger (like the 160 seat B737-800) seems like too big a jump.

I don’t see Airbus pushing to sell more new A319 while those lines are filled with A321 orders and B737-700 are not being sold with the -800 and Max being pushed (I take the long view that Maxs will be accepted again).

The A319 and B737-700 that are flying are aging out. A 100 seat and 120 seat option just seems to fit a need between 76 and 160.

I think you thinking in the right direction and will add that we should start seeing I orders of the E195 too

KLM’s E2 is beautiful

https://www.klm.com/travel/us_en/pre...aer_195_e2.htm

Escargot 04-29-2021 01:01 PM


Originally Posted by Flydafe (Post 3228216)
I think you thinking in the right direction and will add that we should start seeing I orders of the E195 too

KLM’s E2 is beautiful

https://www.klm.com/travel/us_en/pre...aer_195_e2.htm

That's a nice aircraft.

ninerdriver 04-30-2021 11:08 AM


Originally Posted by Flydafe (Post 3228216)
I think you thinking in the right direction and will add that we should start seeing I orders of the E195 too

KLM’s E2 is beautiful

https://www.klm.com/travel/us_en/pre...aer_195_e2.htm

It's pretty, but Embraer probably tanked its midsize viability stateside with the E190's abysmal reliability.

trip 04-30-2021 01:14 PM

No middle seats, a big win, why on earth did the CSeries go with a middle seat?

TransWorld 04-30-2021 08:25 PM


Originally Posted by trip (Post 3228778)
No middle seats, a big win, why on earth did the CSeries go with a middle seat?

Because the DC-9 / MD-80 had a 2-3 seating configuration. Although a clean sheet design, they went with that size fuselage.

It also helps fuel efficiency for that seating, as well as baggage capacity. Think about a 1-1 seating configuration 50 seats long. Think about a 5-5 seating configuration 10 seats long (both for 100 seats). Both extremes are inefficient. There is a sweet spot in between.

LAXtoDEN 04-30-2021 09:11 PM


Originally Posted by ninerdriver (Post 3228727)
It's pretty, but Embraer probably tanked its midsize viability stateside with the E190's abysmal reliability.

Dispatch reliability:
E1 E170 / E175: 99.8%
E1 E190 / E195: 99.4%
E2 E190: 99.9%
Expected is 99.7%

Reliability and maintenance costs have substantially decreased with the E2’s.


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