Please pardon my ignorance here, but can someone let me know what CnR means?

CnR is where dreams go to die. It’s the darkest black hole of indescribable evil and despair on the internet. If you combined a CIA black site torture facility with the DMV and the dumbest, most extreme flat earther convention, that’s where I would go to take a break from CnR.

I would rather be forced to watch 72 hours of Taliban propaganda and six consecutive days of Home Shopping Channel Dagger/Indian Turquoise Specials than spend five minutes on CnR.

I would rather read the YouTube comments from the last Hillary Clinton/Donald Trump debate than read CnR.

Godwin’s law is achieved on every thread in CnR, even if it’s only one post.

I get a funny feeling you have spent more than 5 minutes on CnR.

Granted the slobbering love affair over Morning Haiku or the 19 page rehash of a simple R9/18 that includes everything except the position of the armrest , is kinda painful, every now and then a useful nugget of information exposes itself.

Just trying to inject a little humor.

Your description was funny. We humans love to view death and destruction though, dont we? Well some do anyway.

It has actually mellowed out quite a bit in the last year, with the SLI sort of in the rear view mirror. I expect it to get vicious during negotiations, but that’s a good thing, we need to get people fired up.

For the new military folks, it’s good that you’re happy to be here, you should be. Talk to your buds at other airlines though, and start getting fired up for a better contract. That should be something we can all get behind (unlike the Boeing AB debate:cool:).

This is the most wonderful, amazing thing I have read on here in the history of EVER!!!!

All that's missing is the flames, "VOTE YES ALPA" and "Comin' in hot!"

It’s RJ’s comin’ in hot!

C’mon...
You know that. 😉

CnR, aka Challenge and Response, is a discussion forum on the union website for AA pilots.

In the spirit of the 737 vs 320 new hire questions:

I live 1:10 West of EWR, 1:45 West of LGA and about 2:00 West of JFK (best case driving times with no traffic). EWR is never more than 1:30 drive with traffic.

Reading Sliceback's numbers that a guy can be 41% in base after a year on the 737 LGA is very appealing. But reading that most of the 737I flying is out of JFK has a lot less appeal.

Is there a type of 737 or 320 or D/I flying that would keep a person "mostly" on the EWR side?? It would be great to look forward to a time when I could count on going to EWR most of the time.

I don't care what I fly or where I go. But I would like to "try" to do reserve from home and not drive out to JFK if possible. That becomes a 3+ hour trip at peak travel times, not allotting for parking.

Thanks for all the great advice on this thread and any advice to come!!

I can't speak for the other positions, but it seems to me that if you want to do EWR trips, 737 D is pretty good. You probably won't have much choice on reserve, but once you hold a line (2-3 months at most), you should be able to easily do at least half your trips from EWR, and maybe more. Good luck.

All I see are EWR in TTOT, I bet he could do all his trips from EWR the second he gets a line which will be super quick. About half the 737 I trips are from LGA BTW (someone correct me if I am wrong)

Thank you. It sounds like it is a useful tool that everyone admired and appreciates.

Thanks for the information!!

Thank you!!

Once you are a line holder, you can specify in your bid that you only want EWR trips. I’m sure you will be able to stay in EWR within the first 6 months. Either 737 or AB domestic would work.

Is it just coincidence that all 3 of the planes that skidded off the runway/taxiway in the last 2 weeks were -73s? Maybe AB is the way to go :D

Shots fired

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I spent two months last year on short call in LGA. Because I prefer to fly more than sit, I proactively proffered for trips and had good luck getting EWR trips. Even as a junior guy on reserve, you will be able to exert some control on your schedule if you are smart about it.

TOLO?



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Dos Gringos wasn’t plying loud enough in the background of the A’20s.

[emoji23][emoji23][emoji23]

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I feel like I’ve seen this on the forum somewhere before, but here’s a hypothetical....

Say u live somewhere that has one plane, but not the other in base(73/320). Unfortunately ur not old enough in Indoc to get that plane that is in ur base. Is it ever possible after that day to change equipment pre class start? If not, u can wait 6 months post training then change equipment?

The easiest and fastest way would be to try and get the same airplane in a different base if the base you want isn't available. You can bid to change bases either on the next vacancy bid or via Mutual Base Exchange. A seat lock only applies to changing aircraft...not bases. Although, I'm not sure if you can be awarded a base via MBE if it makes you the junior pilot in base.

If you can't get the same airplane then you'll have to wait until your 6 months are up as you'll be seat locked. You can bid off on the next vacancy but you won't be given a class date until the expiration of your seat lock.

I recommend not bidding the 190 if you're itching to get somewhere else fast. You're highly likely to be withheld on the 190 for up to a year from the effective date of the vacancy.

Expected Upgrade Time for DFW?
 

Howdy all,

I'm most interested in a DFW base, any equipment. Can anyone give an educated guess on the expected timeframe for upgrade in DFW?

I'm trying to weigh the opportunity at AA against some other carriers, but its difficult to compare when the time for upgrade is unknown.

Thanks!

I've been here almost 5 years and I project it will be another 2 years to upgrade in DFW. The junior CA in DFW has been trending more and more junior over the last couple years. Upgrade times in general have been dropping at most of the bases. For someone hired today, using projected retirement numbers, it would take 5.5 years to get to the seniority number of the junior DFW CA (10,4xx june bid). The junior CA in DFW was an 8xxx number last year, so it's dropped about 2000 numbers in the last few bids. A couple years ago the junior 737/A320 was 9xxx and now it's 12,3xx.

If I were to guess for someone hired today, I'd go with just under 5 years for DFW CA. DFW is supposed to be growing this year and 44% of the DFW captains retire in the next 5 years.

The Junior CA, 12,3xx is right at 5 years and is PHL. LAX and DCA are at 12,000 for the junior CA. LGA is 11,500, MIA 11,000

Dfw ca
 

Thanks Viper! That is the type of info I was looking for.

Only thing to keep in mind is that a pretty large portion of that growth will come from the S80 sundown. There are 337 bodies that will need homes, and even with the 320/737 growth in the next three months, you will see an overall decline in NB seats in DFW through October (ref the Aug vacancy message). Time will tell if they stay in Big D or venture elsewhere...

Aug CAs FOs
320 401 394
737 384 371
S80 170 167
Total 955 932


Oct CAs FOs
320 472 466
737 435 404
S80 0 0
Total 907 870

Many of the S80 pilots will be tied up in a training cycle during some portion of these months

The growth in DFW is supposed to come from us taking some B gates from Eagle (six I think) and Eagle will get some gates at the remote E terminal. I have no idea how this is supposed to work with 350 MD-80 guys needing training at the same time. It will be interesting to see where they all go. There are quite a few senior guys on the MD-80, so they have lots of options. I have no idea how many of them are commute vs. live in base.

Maybe other bases are covering the additional DFW flights. I believe DFW will also be adding 787 flying next year, though that may just be replacing 757 flying.

Yes, the 80 guys will have to train... probably in Sep/Oct. That has nothing to do with the forecast numbers for Oct. With less metal and less seats, DFW is contracting in the short term, at least WRT NB positions. As more NXs and MAXs are delivered, that will certainly change -- DFW is the leading hub profit wise, and the gate forecast indicates more flying will come this way.

The biggest takeaway from my post is that the 80 sundown will cause some disruptions to the recent conventional wisdom regarding times to get into / upgrade at DFW. You can expect it to occur again when the 75/76 sundown occurs as well. Sure, there will be more NXs and 78s, but the bottom line is: different fleet mix will mean folks' bidding patterns will definitely be changing.

This isn't even remotely taking into consideration how C2020 may impact the bidding.

The vast majority of the guys I’ve asked on the 80 are planning on staying in DFW. Most will be going to other G2 aircraft, with some moving up to the bigger jets, either CA to CA, or I know of a couple going G2 CA to G4 FO for QOL.

FWIW - heard from two different CKA’s that the 767 will die in PHL and the 757 in DFW. 757 isn’t going anywhere for 5 years, but I think the 787/777 growth in DFW will be for new routes and 767 replacements. Also it will be interesting to see if the DFW/777 starts doing the LHR flying from Vegas/PHX (I forget which one it is).

Anyway, most 757/DFW flying now are hub turns that can easily (and more cheaply) be done by 321’s. The only true 757(I) flying is LIM and then KEF this summer. ANC is going to the 788 (or so the rumor goes). Maybe the 75/76 get CUN back due to 787 utilization this summer but who knows.


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I know from others that MIA 73 does lots of trips south, what about the 319? I use to do that type of flying in a job years ago and loved and miss it.

319s still go down south. It seems that some cities like PTY switch equipment back and forth from the 73 to the 320.

Most of the guys I know that are still on the 80 also say they want to stay in DFW, but they want to stay G2 CA's more. I know a couple that really want CLT, but they cant hold it yet.

The next bid will be interesting for those in DFW, and those wanting to come here.

I finally just got back to DFW, I'm not the plug, but I'm close enough to have all my displacement preferences updated. For me, after two years of commuting to reserve as a G2 captain, I'm done with that bs. If I cant hold on to a G2 CA spot in DFW, I'm going G4 FO.

No question, just some observations from a mental midget:
This is the list of Jr Cpt's starting June 2019:
PHL 320-12143, DCA 737 – 12001, LGA 320-11533, LGA 737 - 11448

Whats interesting, to me at least, is that it appears the 320 is going junior on the CPT side but when I input my seniority into those bases/airframes I came out like this on the FO side:

DCA 320 FO: 86%
PHL 320 FO: 75%
LGA 320 FO: 58%
DCA 737 FO: 50%
LGA 737 FO: 46%

Not sure if those low 320 CPT slots will continue based on the FO numbers. I am thinking of switching over to the 320 and have been looking at the numbers trying to predict the future of CPT upgrades.
The 320 in LGA has about 40% less redeyes than the 737 and flights originate from LGA (55%), JFK (30%), EWR (15%) vs
737 LGA, JFK (42%), LGA (30%), EWR (28%).

For me, getting between LGA-JFK is no problem but I hate the EWR piece so I avoid it.

I am thinking the 8% loss in seniority is worth having less redeyes and EWR trips to avoid. Just going to sit tight waiting on the next vacancy bid to see if the trends continue. I am also looking at DCA 737 but 28% of their trips are out of BWI, which like EWR, seems like a pain in the butt. DCA - IAD, OK no problem but throw BWI into the mix, and I am not sure I want to mess with a base change. They are supposed to grow DCA though so time will tell.

The perfect solution is for ORD to suddenly go super junior but I dont see that anytime soon. I would be at 97% or something stupid. Also looking at LGA 737 International. No redeyes, no EWR, but with such a small bid pack I cant imagine there being much flexibility as a lineholder. I heard the reserves are the company wide *itches and it sucks but I cant verify that.

I prefer DCA trips but when I have to fly out of BWI or IAD I pick BWI because there’s a train. IAD requires an Uber or a bus from the end of the silver line. In reality it is a wash. Both take 2 hours from DCA and cost $10-$15, unless you want to pay 5+ times that and Uber. Also, it seems like there are folks that want all three, so even as a junior line holder I can avoid IAD if I want to.

I started in NY and I’ll gladly take a trip from DCA to BWI or IAD over a trip from Queens to EWR. Plus DCA is an easier commute for me. But hey, you’re senior to me so I prefer you stay where you are!

Good luck.

What’s the seat lock for newhires? Also, what are the pros/cons of getting assigned the A320/1 at LAX in terms of schedules, route variety, etc?

New hire seat lock is 6 months plus can be withheld for another year.

Pro’s

Pretty quick to get a line, the CA’s are good to fly with (most bases are like that, but pretty laid back), pretty big bid status, so lots of options, commutable trips, gain time commuting in from MT or CT. Yes lots of variety in the trips.

Con’s

A lot of trips start with red eyes (can be a pro depending on your point of view). Most trips that start with a red eye, end late. Very expensive place to live if you choose to move there. Expensive hotels for commuters. You pay $1159 a year in CA disability which the company will offset if you go on LTD.

On balance I’m very happy to be based there. For me, best combo of easy commute and great seniority compared to every other base.