APA SLI Proposed List
08-17-2015, 06:14 PM
#371
Unfaithfully yours, Hank
Joined APC: Nov 2006
Position: All
Posts: 222
Originally Posted by Sunvox
The depth of your wrongness knows no bounds.
The NIC award would have reached some eventual conclusion with the courts. It may have been a painfully slow procedure, but the courts would ultimately decide. To any reasonable outside observer with a minor knowledge of airline merger history the actions of the USAir pilots would seem illegal, and ultimately would not have held up in court. The trouble is US courts hate to interfere with major corporations. Your failure to comprehend this simple fact is your and others major downfall.
The Nic will be used, and I stand here today with that prophecy which you can throw back at me when the time comes. No, I have no horse in this race accepting the fact that I abhor internet idiots like you who talk as if they have a clue when in fact they have zero. Honestly I can't wait until this is over so I can go back and quote all your old posts and make you look like the fool you are.
I stand here today with these three predictions:
1) The arbs will use the Nic list.
2) The list will be largely created using a "stovepipe" methodology. Category and Class will be the most important factor in determining the final list.
3) There will be no use of "Pull and Plug".
My name is Joseph Peck. I'm a EWR based pilot at UAL. I'm on FB. I have no relatives or friends that work for or are in any way related to this merger. I HATE the misinformation propagated by people like you on the internet. You might be a great individual with good morals, but the trouble is that the internet has given a voice to people who are not that smart.
Look up my bio . . .
I was my High School Salutatorian and went to Dartmouth College where I completed a double major in Electrical Engineering and History and graduated Magna Cum Laude.
What was your high school rank?
I know . . . I know . . . everybody on this forum is gonna go . . . oooooh ... you're such an ass to pull out the education thing . . . . you're pompous and stupid and impolite. . . you know what . . . I'm too old and the world is changing and I'm simply fed up with idiots that get to stand up in the room and act as if they have a brain . . . you are not as smart as you think you are and if time proves me wrong you can come back and throw egg in my face but if I'm right you bet I'll be back to hold you up as an example of how the internet is full of fools speaking as if they have a clue.
The NIC award would have reached some eventual conclusion with the courts. It may have been a painfully slow procedure, but the courts would ultimately decide. To any reasonable outside observer with a minor knowledge of airline merger history the actions of the USAir pilots would seem illegal, and ultimately would not have held up in court. The trouble is US courts hate to interfere with major corporations. Your failure to comprehend this simple fact is your and others major downfall.
The Nic will be used, and I stand here today with that prophecy which you can throw back at me when the time comes. No, I have no horse in this race accepting the fact that I abhor internet idiots like you who talk as if they have a clue when in fact they have zero. Honestly I can't wait until this is over so I can go back and quote all your old posts and make you look like the fool you are.
I stand here today with these three predictions:
1) The arbs will use the Nic list.
2) The list will be largely created using a "stovepipe" methodology. Category and Class will be the most important factor in determining the final list.
3) There will be no use of "Pull and Plug".
My name is Joseph Peck. I'm a EWR based pilot at UAL. I'm on FB. I have no relatives or friends that work for or are in any way related to this merger. I HATE the misinformation propagated by people like you on the internet. You might be a great individual with good morals, but the trouble is that the internet has given a voice to people who are not that smart.
Look up my bio . . .
I was my High School Salutatorian and went to Dartmouth College where I completed a double major in Electrical Engineering and History and graduated Magna Cum Laude.
What was your high school rank?
I know . . . I know . . . everybody on this forum is gonna go . . . oooooh ... you're such an ass to pull out the education thing . . . . you're pompous and stupid and impolite. . . you know what . . . I'm too old and the world is changing and I'm simply fed up with idiots that get to stand up in the room and act as if they have a brain . . . you are not as smart as you think you are and if time proves me wrong you can come back and throw egg in my face but if I'm right you bet I'll be back to hold you up as an example of how the internet is full of fools speaking as if they have a clue.
08-17-2015, 07:12 PM
#372
Are we there yet??!!
Joined APC: Apr 2006
Posts: 2,010
Originally Posted by Sunvox
1) The arbs will use the Nic list.
2) The list will be largely created using a "stovepipe" methodology. Category and Class will be the most important factor in determining the final list.
3) There will be no use of "Pull and Plug".
2) The list will be largely created using a "stovepipe" methodology. Category and Class will be the most important factor in determining the final list.
3) There will be no use of "Pull and Plug".
2) Agree with you there
3) Maybe, maybe not. We have over 1200 deferees on the L-AA side and that is huge. Most likely the bottom 1200 AA guys will take it on the chin for the deferees, if the list comes out before May 2016.
Then L-US has half of their seniority list retiring in the next five years while L-AA has only 20%. In direct numbers, AA doesn't catch up in actual 1 for 1 retirement in straight numbers until about 2021 (IIRC).
That is huge also.
3 Wild cards for the arbitrators track history.
(No One Cares what your high school GPA was, nor your class standing)
08-17-2015, 10:13 PM
#373
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2011
Posts: 224
Originally Posted by eaglefly
One of the few virtual certanties though is that absent this merger, the West pilots would be where they were on December 8, 2013 with no realistic catalyst to resolve the senioirty impasse between East and West and thus no vehicle to access East International flying or any ability to make a single dollar of financial gain due to either Wide body rates or improved pay scales as part of a newly bargained CBA.
The ONLY reason the West could obtain both of these is via this merger. It's simply my opinion that to accomplish that at the expense of LAA pilots and especially those junior here would be a windfall for the minority West. The CBA pay increases have already been realized by the West. Soon, regardless of how the SLI turns out, significant numbers of West pilots will have access to Group IV metal and higher compensation via that as well. It's also likely that more of the Nic will become evident in whatever final model the arbitrators devise. As it stands now, it will be the West minority that will STILL realize the most benefit out of this merger even without a pure Nic and the dilution of junior LAA pilots using advantageous methodologies cherry-picked from the UAL/CAL SLI.
That is my opinion.
The ONLY reason the West could obtain both of these is via this merger. It's simply my opinion that to accomplish that at the expense of LAA pilots and especially those junior here would be a windfall for the minority West. The CBA pay increases have already been realized by the West. Soon, regardless of how the SLI turns out, significant numbers of West pilots will have access to Group IV metal and higher compensation via that as well. It's also likely that more of the Nic will become evident in whatever final model the arbitrators devise. As it stands now, it will be the West minority that will STILL realize the most benefit out of this merger even without a pure Nic and the dilution of junior LAA pilots using advantageous methodologies cherry-picked from the UAL/CAL SLI.
That is my opinion.
2) This big issue with the west is hard to follow. The west pilot issue is vis a vis other US Airways pilots. West pilots slot in higher on a combined US airways list, other US airways folks gets pushed down. Junior AA guys end up in the same place.
3 Where west could really win is if they get slotted in close to Nic and then get some benefit in the ISL based on the expected combined us airways attrition from east side mostly which is going to be huge.
4) Isn't the issue for the junior AA guys the folks not flying coming in above them on the AA list plus lower expected attrition?
Should be fun!
08-18-2015, 02:45 AM
#374
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2011
Posts: 1,967
Originally Posted by dynap09
1) It might have taken a while, but despite east assertions it's hard to see how in the long run east could have succeeded in making the end run around the arb award. They've been warned (now ordered) about this. It is possible east could have dragged it out another 10 years though without pay raises for anyone by just avoiding proposing a list, so no question that this merger is a BIG win for the ENTIRE east / west pilot group as it forces resolution. They should ALL bow down to AA.
2) This big issue with the west is hard to follow. The west pilot issue is vis a vis other US Airways pilots. West pilots slot in higher on a combined US airways list, other US airways folks gets pushed down. Junior AA guys end up in the same place.
3 Where west could really win is if they get slotted in close to Nic and then get some benefit in the ISL based on the expected combined us airways attrition from east side mostly which is going to be huge.
4) Isn't the issue for the junior AA guys the folks not flying coming in above them on the AA list plus lower expected attrition?
Should be fun!
2) This big issue with the west is hard to follow. The west pilot issue is vis a vis other US Airways pilots. West pilots slot in higher on a combined US airways list, other US airways folks gets pushed down. Junior AA guys end up in the same place.
3 Where west could really win is if they get slotted in close to Nic and then get some benefit in the ISL based on the expected combined us airways attrition from east side mostly which is going to be huge.
4) Isn't the issue for the junior AA guys the folks not flying coming in above them on the AA list plus lower expected attrition?
Should be fun!
The East never had a DFR to the West.
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