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Fdxlag2 09-10-2018 05:58 AM


Originally Posted by Flytolive (Post 2671354)
You'll have to explain that because it doesn't appear on its face to make any sense at all.


Hardly a ringing endorsement much less support for nuclear.

Go back to your capacity charts. Wind and solar work but you need to generate some electricity when it is night and the wind isn’t blowing. Thus despite all of the new solar and wind capability coal capacity remains relatively stable. Nuclear is too expensive to compete with coal part time. Besides that solar and wind suck up all of the subsidy dollars. Try thinking not channeling algore.

Mesabah 09-10-2018 06:46 AM


Originally Posted by Flytolive (Post 2671354)
You'll have to explain that because it doesn't appear on its face to make any sense at all.

Sure, I can explain it to you in my best layman's terms. The power you get to your house is kept within certain parameters. Baseload power plants, i.e. coal, gas, nuclear, hydro, can maintain these parameters through gearing and throttling of the generator turbine. Explained in this video:



Testing this process is what led to Chernobyl blowing up. Anyways, Solar and wind are additional power sources, when they are available(wind blowing, sun shining)They can be added to the grid for excess power. However, this constant flux of power capacity creates price instability in the market. With the expense of Nuclear, these plants can not survive in a market of fluctuating prices. Only cheap coal/gas can be used for baseload in a solar/wind market.

Mesabah 09-10-2018 07:32 AM

Also, Bill Gates reactor, runs the turbine on the Brayton cycle, whereas, coal, gas, current nuclear are on the Rankine cycle. Brayton being ~60% efficiency vs Rankine's ~45%.

Flytolive 09-10-2018 07:33 AM


Originally Posted by Mesabah (Post 2671381)
However, this constant flux of power capacity creates price instability in the market. With the expense of Nuclear, these plants can not survive in a market of fluctuating prices.

I appreciate the effort, but your argument still doesn't make sense. Markets including energy fluctuate all the time. Products' reliability and consistency are always part of pricing. Markets do a lousy job of accounting for negative economic externalities and new and not so new technologies including energy depend/benefit from government subsidies/support. You make a good case for the potential of nuclear, but don't seem to want to acknowledge its challenges while being anxious to do so for other clean technologies.

Mesabah 09-10-2018 08:41 AM


Originally Posted by Flytolive (Post 2671418)
I appreciate the effort, but your argument still doesn't make sense. Markets including energy fluctuate all the time. Products' reliability and consistency are always part of pricing. Markets do a lousy job of accounting for negative economic externalities and new and not so new technologies including energy depend/benefit from government subsidies/support. You make a good case for the potential of nuclear, but don't seem to want to acknowledge its challenges while being anxious to do so for other clean technologies.

Solar and wind are scams, if it were simply free market, we would only have coal and gas. The engineering world is telling you, if you want clean energy you need the government to run almost all nuclear, with some hydro where locations permit, in a not free market. The challenges of nuclear are nothing compared to the scam of wind and solar.

There obviously is nothing I can say that will convince you that the left is running a green energy scam. However, we in the first world, exported our emissions to third world countries, we then promised billions to clean up our mess, but the money never arrived. https://www.nytimes.com/2018/09/09/w...l-warming.html
Instead it was funneled into the bank accounts of left wing venture capitalist firms, and to people who own them like Al Gore. The left then blames Trump, and the right for everything they did.

Flytolive 09-10-2018 08:59 AM


Originally Posted by Mesabah (Post 2671460)
Solar and wind are scams, if it were simply free market, we would only have coal and gas. The engineering world is telling you, if you want clean energy you need the government to run almost all nuclear, with some hydro where locations permit, in a not free market. The challenges of nuclear are nothing compared to the scam of wind and solar.

Complete double standard from an engineer's perspective. If only the world was that simple.


Originally Posted by Mesabah (Post 2671460)
The left then blames Trump, and the right for everything they did.

Stop projecting. The Republicans have all the levers of power. Make nuclear happen if the Dems were the problem.

ItnStln 09-10-2018 02:02 PM


Originally Posted by tomgoodman (Post 2671128)
Weighted down by name-calling, your arguments have sunk like Kansai Airport. Fortunately for the environmentalist cause, spokespersons with better manners are available. :rolleyes:

That’s what their party does, insult those who have other opinions.

ItnStln 09-10-2018 02:03 PM


Originally Posted by Flytolive (Post 2671257)
They are not my arguments. They are those of the overwhelming scientific consensus not to mention common sense. As for your posts I can't recall any that have added much to this or any other APC discussion. Not exactly a "man in the arena."

Obvious and nonsensical BS deserves to called what it is.

https://www.skepticalscience.com/argument.php

I have some carbon credits I’ll sell you if you’re that concerned.

Glenntilton 09-10-2018 03:02 PM


Originally Posted by Mesabah (Post 2671460)
Solar and wind are scams, if it were simply free market, we would only have coal and gas. The engineering world is telling you, if you want clean energy you need the government to run almost all nuclear, with some hydro where locations permit, in a not free market. The challenges of nuclear are nothing compared to the scam of wind and solar.

There obviously is nothing I can say that will convince you that the left is running a green energy scam. However, we in the first world, exported our emissions to third world countries, we then promised billions to clean up our mess, but the money never arrived. https://www.nytimes.com/2018/09/09/w...l-warming.html
Instead it was funneled into the bank accounts of left wing venture capitalist firms, and to people who own them like Al Gore. The left then blames Trump, and the right for everything they did.

This about sums it up.

ItnStln 09-10-2018 06:40 PM


Originally Posted by Mesabah (Post 2671460)
Solar and wind are scams, if it were simply free market, we would only have coal and gas. The engineering world is telling you, if you want clean energy you need the government to run almost all nuclear, with some hydro where locations permit, in a not free market. The challenges of nuclear are nothing compared to the scam of wind and solar.

There obviously is nothing I can say that will convince you that the left is running a green energy scam. However, we in the first world, exported our emissions to third world countries, we then promised billions to clean up our mess, but the money never arrived. https://www.nytimes.com/2018/09/09/w...l-warming.html
Instead it was funneled into the bank accounts of left wing venture capitalist firms, and to people who own them like Al Gore. The left then blames Trump, and the right for everything they did.

Well said!


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