Hello gents, first year FO in the 121 world and have some conflicting info to work through.
Throughout my initial ratings/ATP training I was put under the impression that it would be mandatory to upgrade on the regionals and build some PIC time before even been looking at. However, it seems like times has changed quite drastically in the past year and it seems like people are getting pulled right from the right seat into Mainline/LCC carriers.
I have asked around and it seems like the advice is 50/50. Some guys are convinced that staying, upgrading and getting the PIC time is the best option...others say to move onto a LCC, get a type rating along with a lot more money/QOL and wait it out there.
I also understand that I am not yet quite competitive but I do plan to work a bunch this year and should be in position for either scenario (upgrade or LCC interview) by the end of the year.
Mainline would ultimately be the goal and living in NYC area means the options are essentially endless considering I will most likely stay here for at least the near future.
Any thoughts are all greatly appreciated!

 

If your goal is absolutely Big Six, safest bet is to sit tight and upgrade. Keep ALL of your apps meticulously updated as soon as you meet published mins.

Odds are good that this will work out for you over the next 3-5 years or less.

Most of the top majors will hire a few regional FO's, don't bank on it but keep the apps updated because it might be you.

Going to an LCC will likely delay your progression to the Big Six, because they are not impressed by LCC FO time, it holds about the same weight as regional FO time so you might well have to upgrade at the LCC before the top guys call. But at that point you're probably five+ years in making close to 300k... hard to leave. Adding a type rating will increase your app score, but nowhere near as much as 121 TPIC.

So really it comes down to aggressiveness vs. security. If you're hell bent on making top dollar, better make your resume look like what the Big Six like to see. If you'd rather just bag a good job asap and settle in for life, take the first LCC gig you can get.

That all assumes you have a pretty clean record... if you have significant black marks which will be problematic for the big guys, an early move to an LCC might make a lot of sense. Get your seniority and hope for a merger... worst case you still have a good job.

 

Getting some PIC before moving on is a good idea.....there were a lot of pilots furloughed from majors after 9/11 who had no PIC time and thus didn’t meet the minimums for lots of other great jobs. It seems inconceivable that those times could return, but on 9/10/01 it seemed equally inconceivable.

 

Actually, when this hiring "wave" started, pilots with NO PIC time have been getting slots in higher numbers than the 2 previous on the legacy level.

With that said, pilots with no TPIC are still in a small (relatively) amount compared to the rest of the pilots in any given new hire class.

I know, someone is going to shout "well in my new hire class (insert big number) of pilots didn't have PIC!!!!!". Sure, and the class before them/after them probably had few to no pilots without PIC.

How's your resume? Technical degree and/or big aviation U with a high GPA and a masters along with collateral/extracurriculars? Volunteer work? Are you networking?

You don't really have options until you have offers on the table.

It's shifted somewhat as far as the LCC/ULCC's go. Meaning, upgrades for the most part are back to being quick in the relative spectrum. Not too long ago, upgrades were stagnant at many regionals and an FO had few chances to boost their flight qualifications at the regional so they went to a LCC/ULCC/ACMI. And it worked for many. But it's all a moving target based on A LOT of factors in the application algorithm/scoring process. This, and other message boards/forums are plentiful with the FO that that did it, and hasn't heard a peep yet after years of making the move.

But along the lines of the other posters, upgrade and get some PIC, try to take on a volunteer position with your MEC, keep your record clean, try to get into a safety/instructing position. The last couple can be achieved without being a CA in many cases.

 

Not disagreeing with you, but how many mandatory retirements where there in the years following 9/11 through 2008?

Someone please correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't the vast majority of movement from the late 90's to the early 2000's come from economic growth and not retirements?

 

Alright, sounds good. Appreciate the quick responses and insight!
Im fortunate enough in the sense that I have a clean history and even if I’m at a LCC for a few years I still think that I would be able to make it to the big six by 30.
But as stated above, aggressive vs comfortable sounds pretty accurate. I can imagine that as you get older the more time you invest in a company, the smaller the chance is that you’d want to leave.

 

Typically, yes.

And I've flown with guys who were "restless" in their youth, and kept jumping ship at the first hint of turbulence. If they had sat tight more often (especially at their first major), they'd have still ended up in the same place with MUCH better seniority. My observations hint that lateral moves should be avoided... stick with clear upward moves (at all levels).