LampCommander

I am in the process of expunging an old DUI arrest that I got the judge to throw out. The waiver for the expunction form stated that is could/might still show up on a federal background check. Do airlines utilize a federal background check or a third party? Will this show up in my application process for part 121 flying? Im thinking they will see it and it will be an issue with hiring. I am trying to get a feel for how to navigate this moving forward. Strangely my AME did not ask me anything when applying for my 1st class medical. Any help greatly appreciated...

rickair7777

They are entitled to use the federal check, and IIRC they may be required to do so. The PRIA system is currently undergoing some changes and I don't know all the ins and outs.

Under the old system, most likely.

Also... when the federal government asks you "have you ever been"... they mean that literally. Just because the record was expunged at the state/local level does not mean you can lie to the fed. That's go to jail stuff. Applies to your FAA medical application (which does ask about DUI convictions and arrests), and things like security clearance and probably SIDA.

The airlines are far more concerned with honesty and integrity than with a single DUI. Disclosing a DUI might delay your career progression to top tier airlines. Lying about a DUI will get you blacklisted if caught.

The application most certainly did ask about DUI's... hope you were honest on that. A single DUI might not have required follow up from the AME.

Excargodog

https://www.faa.gov/about/office_org...nformation.pdf

WHACKMASTER

If the application asks if you’ve ever been CONVICTED of a DUI, from what you wrote it seems you could honestly answer “NO”.

If however it asks if you’ve ever been ARRESTED for a DUI, well that’s seemingly a different story.

You’re not lying if an airline asks on the app if you’ve ever been convicted but I sure as hell would have an honest and polished explanation ready if the arrest part comes up.

Your best bet here might be some of the interview coaching services. They should be experts at this stuff.

JohnBurke

As noted above by others, your immediate concern is not what employers may ask, but the implication in your post that you've already made false statements to the FAA.

The questions that you answer when filling out your application for a medical certificate online, when completing the application on medexpress, specify the nature of what's being asked. Whether your doctor (AME) "asked," is irrelevant. He doesn't have to, because you've already been asked when you fill out the application, before you ever show up at the doctor's office.

If you didn't specify the requested information regarding your DUI, your immediate concern is falsification of your application. This, like your logbook and an application for an airman certificate, is a legal document, and you sign it, either by hand or digitally, attesting to the truthfulness of the application. When you do that, you've made a legal certification on a federal form, to a federal agency, and it does carry ramifications. Whether a future employer "catches" you or not is presently irrelevant, as you need to fix this problem first.

When you sign your application for a medical certificate, you agree to a search of the national driver registry. Your criminal history is not consolidated in one place, meaning that expunging a record isn't as simple as obtaining a court order, nor will a court order at a particular level of jurisdiction make its way or be known to all databases or sources.

Under the new Pilot Record Database, replacing PRIA (prior records improvement act), all records are lifetime records. Whereas previously an employer might look back a few years, the PRD will follow you for the rest of your life.

Acts that become a matter of police record are first captured at the level of the investigating agency; if you were pulled over by city PD, then you will have a record of that event at the city level. It's become largely standard practice with most agencies, to upload information not only to their own record keeping system, but to state and federal databases; notably the NCIC, or national crime information computer system. When certain checks are run through NCIC, including a III request, which is a criminal history check, everything that's been uploaded will come up. If you've been a party to an investigation, subject, suspect, or have been convicted, there's a good chance it's there, and that record will typically be your entire adult life. It is not expunged, because it represents not only convictions, but every other aspect in which you became a party to a police action. If you reported a drunk driver, you may be included there, if that information was uploaded. If you were suspected of shoplifting and interviewed or a party of interest, that information may also be there. If you were arrested for a DUI, that information will almost certainly be there, regardless of the disposition of the case at a later date. Additionally, when NCIC is accessed, "wants checks" are performed, in which any known outstanding warrants are also included. It's entirely possible to have an outstanding warrant issued for a parking violation, for example, for which you're unaware. You parked at the beach in California, didn't pay the fee, and ultimately after back and forth, a bench warrant has been issued and you don't know about it.

Cheryl Cage published a book a number of years ago, much of which is still relevant, called, "Reporting Clear," which covers doing your own background check to make sure you know what's in your credit history, national driver registry, local, state, and federal record systems, etc. It's best to know what's there and how it can impact you. Several years ago the FAA did a cross-record investigation that linked a number of applicants to social welfare payments for disability; people were drawing various disabilities but claiming good health with no reported events on their medical, and those people came under scrutiny, investigation, and ultimately certificate action (enforcement) for fraud and falsification, both by the FAA, and by external agencies, as well as were in criminal jeopardy.

When the local PD arrests you, the nature of the arrest may be part of a mutual aid agreement between agencies; your arrest may have been booked locally, or through the county, or perhaps a state trooper handled the arrest; your records may be found at multiple levels, both jail records and multiple other databases. In addition to federal searches of your criminal history, you'll also need to know what's included at the state level, typically with a bureau of criminal investigation (BCI), though various states use various agencies and names. An arrest may involve both local and county record keeping; you need to know where and which were involved, and you need to know where it was uploaded from there (national driver registry, NCIC, etc.

A DUI isn't the end of the world (personal opinion: it ought to be...and certainly ought to be a barrier to professional flight); failure to report it or own up to it can be a very big deal, however...much bigger than the DUI itself. Falsification of an application by not admitting the arrest, or by putting your legal signature on a statement that you have not been arrested, is an offense which is independent of the DUI.

That said, there are a lot of pilots out there with arrests and convictions for driving under the influence, who are enjoying long and successful careers. The time since the event, the disposition, and perhaps most important of all, what you learned from it, are all mitigating factors that are considered when the arrest or conviction becomes known. An employer will want honesty; if you're asked about an arrest, and you were arrested, then own it. Make no excuses. Accept the fault and the blame, because anything else will be viewed as attempting to justify or skate out of your responsibility, and that is not a good look for a professional aviator. Show that you learned from the event, and what you've done to ensure it never happens again. Do not say, "I got a judge to...expunge, throw out, ignore, drop to a lesser charge, etc," because that sounds very much like saying "I got away with a lot," which is that bad look you want to avoid. There's a difference between saying "a judge found that my case did not merit a conviction," and "I got a judge to hide it." You see the difference? Sometimes it's in what happened, often in the way you view it, and the way you present it (some might say "spin" it). Discretion.

Above and beyond all, don't ever drink and drive again, if indeed that's what happened. Ever. After that, you will need to fix any issues relating to failure to report, or false statements. You will need to get a thorough background check done on yourself, so you know what your record says, and then you can move on and know with confidence how to present yourself to an employer.

rickair7777

Also if you did submit an FAA form 8500 and did not disclose a DUI, you need to call an aviation lawyer IMMEDIATELY because when you signed the 8500 you authorized the FAA to do a NDR check and when that comes back with a DUI that you didn't report they will forward you to the FBI/DOJ for prosecution for lying on the form... that carries up to five years in prison (it says that right on the bottom of the 8500).

galaxy flyer

Slightly related, when the FBI had the tip on finding Whitey Bulger in LA, they ran the alias he was using. Guess what, 12 years before he was stopped by a rural Louisiana cop on traffic stop—wants and warrants check was still in the system. Cop let me go with a verbal warning. This stuff never goes away.

Excargodog

An old NYT article had this to say:

Earthboundmsfit

Even though he’d most certainly be in hot water w the FAA in terms of certificate revocation, I seriously doubt he’d be criminally prosecuted for that even though technically he could be.

Excargodog

And how does a certificate revocation look on one’s PRIA?

A PP who flies because he’s got the money to afford an expensive hobby is one thing. If you expect flying to be your livelihood there are mistakes you can’t afford to make…