Advice for Female Pilots, What About Marriage
 

I'm finally on the path with my flying career and wondering if any female pilots (or males I suppose) could weigh in on the effects on a marriage. I'm not currently married, nor do I have kids. I do hope to be married one day. I understand it can be very stressful and time apart can be difficult, but most of what I read deals with men in the industry and understandably so.

But I'm looking for the good, the bad and the ugly on how it works if the wife is a pilot. And what if both are pilots? Any tales to tell?

I'm new and apologize if this isn't correct thread location :rolleyes:

Marriage has the same complications for both make and female pilots. You just need the right partner to make it work. Independence, trust, and lack of jealous tendencies are key.

Kids are a whole nother issue. All of my female friends except one have had kids and quit, one ended up doing low key part time charter work. One friend doesn't have kids yet but she's worried about what's going to happen when she does...sounds to me like she's going to quit too.

IMO…..DO NOT get married Till you get your career job and are settled in for a few years. Enjoy your freedom and schedule and the ability to travel. SEE the World. DO NOT get hooked up with someone that is locked into a 9-5 M-F job. Travel all you can. Learn to do it by yourself. Or find a friend that has a flexible schedule that is compatible to travel with. You will have much better schedules if you fly weekends. If you are flying 75-90 hours a month plan on 10-12 nights in a hotel. The person you like in your 20's may not be the one you like in your 30's-40's. SPOUSES (and kids) ARE DREAM KILLERS.

This goes for Males and Females.

“Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime.”

Mark Twain

@AKpilot
Really. I guess you would rather hand fly an ILS than be with your family. I feel bad for you; and your family. Must be a real family first kinda guy.

@chicwithwings
Finding the right spouse is imperative and more difficult than it sounds. Make sure your future husband has lived the lifestyle with you before you tie the knot. Living together is a good idea. That way he sees first hand what your lifestyle is like.

Have serious conversations about what having kids would be like. Can he be on his own with the kids for 2,3,4 days at a time? Would he resent you for it? Will he expect you to do all the cleaning,cooking, and child care when you get home from a trip; because he just did all that on his own for the past few days?

I suppose you should even ask yourself if YOU could leave your kids for that length of time. Some mothers have a very very difficult time leaving their young children for even one night.

@romeojulietlima
I agree do not. Do not. Do not. Marry another pilot or flight attendant.

I'm a female who happens to be married to another pilot-big surprise there. Here are some of the advantages and disadvantages I see.

Some of the disadvantages are the fact that if you can't get your schedules to match up, you'll hardly ever see the person. If they work 9-5, at least you'd get to see them in the evenings on your days off. Also, because no one is home the whole time to do the day-to-day things, it all needs done on your precious few days off which leaves little time for a lot of fun-bills need to be paid, laundry needs to be done, groceries need to be shopped for and the place needs to be cleaned. Also, by marrying a fellow pilot, unless one of you is willing to quit flying, pay for a nanny, or live close to family, it's pretty hard to have a kid and hope they turn out all right. If the kid is having a rough day, you still can't skype a hug. Also, if you both work for different carriers with different hubs, one if not both of you is gonna have to commute.

I'd say the biggest advantage of marrying a fellow pilot is that they know all the sh!t you have to go through in this career. They get that training takes 2-3 months, you can't always talk, you may be commuting and away from home a lot with the added expense of a crash pad, and all the other less than ideal parts of this career.

Either way, like someone said before, you definitely need to find someone who is supportive, secure, not jealous and has a life of their own as well. Also, as someone else mentioned, I think it's a lot easier to find someone after you're settled in this career for a little while. Remember while you're doing everything to get that dream flying job, if you're married, that person is along for the ride too which isn't always fun. I met my husband when I was starting out at a regional and he's been really supportive throughout the last several years we've been together but it's definitely not easy. During that time, we've lived like gypsies moving every few years to follow the opportunity, we've spent a lot of time apart and have had countless discussions about our future depending on what airline I end up at. It's nice to have someone to go through all this with but it's a lot to take for that person who is along for the ride during this whole time. During all this time, my husband was with a stable company that lets him live pretty much anywhere. If he would've been chasing airplanes, upgrades and bases at the same time, I can't even imagine how difficult our lives could've been.

If you have any more questions, feel free to PM me.

Never married, or divorced?

AAARRRGGHHH!!!:D

In any case, spouses and kids can derail your dreams. However, if you focus on establishing your career first, THEN get married and have some kids you'll be just fine. Talk to some airline pilots, they'll tell you all about bidding lines, being on reserve, seniority, crashpads, and all of the other relationship killers you'll have to endure at the beginning of your career. From what I've been reading, your quality of life will improve dramatically the more senior you are. Then maybe you can plan for a family.

One thing she never mentioned in the original post was her career desires. If you want to be an airline pilot, things will be harder (by nature of the schedule) than if you have a job with more time at home. I know many female pilots with families that fly 91 corporate or scheduled 135. It's a little different when you know your schedule in advance and can set things around it.

Such good advice from you all and some interesting points. Who knows who will cross my path, but it occurred to me that I'm increasing my chances of meeting a pilot just because I'd be immersed in that atmosphere. The plan now is to do exactly what @AKpilot suggested. Do my thing, and enjoy life and career a bit. The rest will come :)

@flygirl: it was nice to hear your perspective

@directto: for now, I'm feeling that corporate may be the right fit for me, but I'm keeping an open mind where the airlines are concerned.

Just be sure to leave the door open. I have a friend who was so focused on getting to her dream job, that she passed on getting married earlier. Now she's 41, never married, no kids and wandering what happened.

Another note, if/when you marry, there are a ton of things to discuss. A friend of mine just got divorced over kids. They talked about having them before marriage agreeing that they did want kids. The problem is they never discussed what it really meant. He flies for UPS, she for SWA. He expected her to stay home, she expected him to stay home. Her solution was to have the grandparents raise the kids.

My wife grew up a military brat with her father then flying for the airlines. She knew what the lifestyle was like, doesn't like it all the time, but handles it pretty well. Spouses only kill dreams if you let them. She was in the fashion industry and used to travelling so it made life easier/enjoyable that we could pick up at a moments notice and leave.

I travel the world with my job, but I've always found it more enjoyable to do it with someone else.

Military couples go through these same issues. It's not easy, but it can be done. Your future spouse will need to pass these two tests:
(1) Do you wants kids? If so, will he play Mr. Mom? Your job is far too uncertain to have a spouse who cannot reliably look after the kids or provide transportation to child are during work.
(2) It's not just a marriage, it's a partnership. You have to be COMPLETELY ok with being apart from each other for extended periods of time, and have complete trust in yourself and each other not to cross the boundaries you set for each other.

Don't rush. If it happens, it happens. If you marry another pilot or F/A, it would be wise to pursue a different path in aviation, specifically one that keeps you at home more.

My wife and I were both 121 pilots for a period of time. Now neither of us are flying for a living anymore. We "thought" we had our ducks in a row, but life is full of surprises. My advice is, have Plan B in mind in case Plan A does not work out. I am happy to say that I am still married (almost 20 yrs) and have a wonderful kid. I am a very involved dad, and would not trade it for anything!

Like others have said, if crew marries crew life can very hard with kids. This is usually a recipe for disaster unless one or both hangs up the wings when the kids come.

For female pilots, this raises an extra challenge...they usually end up married to male pilots because that's who they're around all the time. This often work fine until you have kids. My recommendation to a female pilot would be to don't date pilots unless it's just a fun thing.

She asked for opinions. I offered one. Don't come in and insult me for my opinions. You are saying the people in my life need to be pitied. They are all fine and happy. Read the post again. I'll translate.... I never said family is not important! This job is not easy to get. Why not enjoy the fruits of all your hard work. Enjoy your flexible schedule and the ability to travel. Get out see the world and have some adventures. Be a well rounded worldly person and marry a well rounded worldly person and you will probably have high functioning children. I had to move across the country to take flying jobs several times when I was young. I couldn't have done it with a wife and kids. I've had 5 airlines fold under me. I chose to be a pilot because I love to fly and travel and there is no way I could do an office job. I've been to 45 countries and I'm functional in 3 languages.

Bottom line... Get the best job / airline you can get. Go live where you want. Travel and adventure out for a few years. Then find someone that fits in your adventurous fulfilling life. Then have children if you want. My parents got married in their late twenties back in the early 50's and they were unhappy till they got divorced 22 years later. It's no fun living in a dysfunctional home. Look at the divorce rate, it's 50-60 %. That's about what it is with the people I fly with. Half the people that are still married would like to get out. If you have a great marriage and great kids I am thrilled. Good for you I hope it lasts. I'm glad for those who are lucky. I hope your parents are still alive and happily married. Hopefully the older and wiser you get the better you will be able chose a compatible spouse.

I know several single female pilots at my airline that are having a great life and traveling the world. One senior f/o has passed up captain years ago because she loves her schedule and travels all the time. She travels with some other pilot friends. And I say good for her!

Just an one opinion from an old guy who has been around the block a few times.

Of my female (airline) pilot friends, only two are married.

Both are married to other pilots that they met either in college, or at the airlines and both are no longer flying.

One is an instructor pilot, and the other recently left to raise the family. The kids seemed to always be a large part of the equation, one of the couples used a live in nanny for a bit, but after both did career changes for several years (and realizing that a non-flying job wasn't for them) decided to get back in the fray and apparently the "flying job" wasn't a right fit either. The other got out several months before her and her spouse started trying for a baby, and this arrangement has actually proven incredibly stable for them.

Both partners flying is a challenge, but it's not insurmountable, especially if you're still willing to do some travel to see your spouse. If both individuals are in the airlines and you have opposite schedules, you might find that your spouse will be showing up at your overnights on occasion to have some "joint time".

When I was still flying actively, the time away didn't really seem to get between my wife and I unless she was having a rough week with work in her 9-5. There's only so much a person can do or say over the phone, and on occasion someone just wants you there with them. She did pretty well with it, but now that I've been home for five years, and we're two kids deep, I don't think she'd enjoy for one minute me being gone for three or four days at a time. I can't say I blame her for that, as it'd be quite an adjustment...and I'd have a hard time justifying an enormous pay cut just to "live the dream".

Just remember, life changes, people changes, goals change, and dreams change...there's nothing you can do about that, just try to keep that person at a central person in your life and your thoughts and marriage can work in or out of a flying career.

Female pilots are social anomalies.... more often the only kind of husband they can attract is another airline pilot or MIL... Cubical/office dude wants to know action is available each night, doesn't understand four day trips and a private hotel room each night in a male dominated industry.... airline/MIL guys do...

Female pilots make poor moms. That doesn't mean they don't love their kids, but its like an earlier comment.. you can't skype a hug...

This might come as a shock, but there are in fact plenty of professions outside of "pilot" that require extensive travel, and have a high percentage of women in them.

Do your own survey... about 80-90% of married female pilots are married to airline pilots and/or MIL guys... only a pilot can understand... female pilots...

A solid family is a good start for a Plan B.

When you retire in 30 years, your family will still be there.
When you get furloughed, your family will still be there.
When you lose your medical and can't fly anymore, your family will still be there.

Find the right person with whom to start one.

Sounds like solid advice - actually for any career I suppose. Thank you all for your responses so far and thanks for taking the question seriously :)

There are so many different examples of couples doing it wrong and so many of them doing it right. Have to find what works for you. Even outside of aviation it is very hard for both members of a marriage to find great jobs in the same town where one isn't sacrificing for the other.

I'll only add what two grey haired US Air pilots told me when I was a new turboprop FO jump seating. Don't wait on this career to live your life. Don't say "I'll get married/have kids/buy a home/whatever when I get a raise/upgrade/work for a major". Too many times it will take longer than you think and you will have spent your life putting work before everything else that's really important.

An oldie but a goodie to reiterate the point:
The story of the Professor and the Jar | Juvenate

@Tom a Hawk - that was great! And you're right, these lessons apply no matter what career you're pursuing

I am living proof this is a fact. It sure was in my life.

Sorry @DonRamon :( So are you not flying at all, flying less than you intended, or ? Do you think the same result would have happened with any career you pursued or just flying?

Talk about narrow-minded! Don't listen to this guy; everyone's situation is unique.

He might not be quite as narrow-minded as you think. I've seen it play out dozens of times with friends in both aviation and the military.

Either the spouse makes you quit, killing the dream or worse you end up divorced with kids in which case you're financially handcuffed to your current gig, and geographically constrained to the kids. Hard to take the paycut and sit reserve at LGA when the ex and kids are in SMF and need alimony and child support. Some of these guys just desperately want out of aviation but they can't even afford to re-train and start a new career. Chained to the left seat of a CRJ like an ancient galley slave...

Family is certainly the priority once you have one, but I wouldn't jump into that too early if you're a professional pilot. Trust me, it works better if you wait till a little later in your career. Flip side is if you wait too long, you might end up rich, lonely, and with a lot of free time on your hands.

I've been fortunate enough to not get caught up in this sort of mess, but I've certainly seen plenty of it. Definitely worth considering.

Please, he blatantly said DO NOT GET MARRIED. Each individual situation is tailor-made. Yes, he is narrow-minded with that comment.

Thank you. In my situation, the same result would have probably happened in any career I chose, unless it paid over 100k a year to start. Jk, but you understand what I mean.
I am flying now, and very happy / satisfied with my life now...just regret that I didn't get a good start until I was over 45. But, I know too that everything happens for a reason. Had things happened differently, I probably would not have ever met my current wife. I met her after I started flying and this is the only life she knows so she is perfectly happy.
Guys / girls, get YOUR stuff together and get YOUR career started before getting settled in with your significant other. That's my .02

He's probably speaking with the voice of experience. People need to learn from the experiences of others, if somebody who went before you can get burned that badly it can probably happen to you too.

Have you attended a Women in Aviation Conference to get some input?

Women in Aviation, International Official Site

Many would disagree but I believe FedEx has the potential for better schedules than most airlines and are more user friendly for families and especially wives and mothers when you get a little seniority. There is such a variety of flying. Some pilot moms bid out and back trips so they are home everyday. Others stay senior in their seat and delay upgrade to Captain to get schedules that fit their lifestyle. Some drop and giveaway trips for further quality of life. Of course, things could change!

My suggestion is to try and connect with women in the profession and get some valuable input to prepare for your long term goals.

Im not working currently working as a pilot, but Ive definitely spent time over seas away from the wife. Its tough but if your dedicated to your relationship you can make it work. just remember it takes two.

So that makes it HIS experience.
Trying to say that a family in some way is a dream killer is just a mirror of that person's own experiences and does nothing in the way of predicting anyone elses' future.
So rickair7777 - if someone comes on the forum and relates a wonderful experience with family and career - does that make it anymore right for the rest of the masses and everyone should run out and get married at the first opportunity?

You guys should ban each other... ;)

You haven't had the pleasure of working in the commercial sector...my point was that this dude's experience is all too common, maybe even the norm. Sad to say that more civili pilots have probably had a bad experience than not.

I'm tired of flying with guys whose lives suck because of these situations.

Yes...having worked in the "commercial sector" makes all the difference :rolleyes:
I know plenty of both without the benefit of your vast commerical experience. It isn't all one way or another no matter how much you want it to be.

Life is a series of choices. Choose what is important to you.

After a long time observing a lot of different combinations, I would suggest making a family lower than your top priority does not turn out well long term for you, .....or for society at large.

.

Wise words @mooneymite :)

Moderators can say what they want without reprocussion.