Question for FDX contract gurus
 

I was hired in Sep. 2006, as a S/O on the 727. Best job in the world. We were able to meet many people during our 1st few weeks. We were informed by the gentleman who was explaining standing bids, that we would be eligible for passover pay because of junior 727 FO's being hired.

He said that we would have to put 727 FO as a bid choice and that it had to be ahead of the 727 S/O bid choice.

I looked at the passover pay portion of the contract and was only able to locate one area that seemed to address this issue (24.E.5.a-d).

Anybody have any knowledge on this?

Did I mention best job in the world!!

Be careful how you bid regarding passover pay
 

Like you, I was hired as a 727 s/o. I short time later they started hiring directly into the 727 f/o seat and assured us that we would be eligible for passover pay. I short time later I upgraded to DC-10 s/o.

At my year anniversary I expected to see the 727 f/o passover pay (I think it was higher than DC-10 s/o pay?). I didn't receive it ... when I called to find out why, I was told that I did not have 727 f/o on my last bid so I was not entitled to the passover pay. I asked where this was written so that I could verify this information for myself. I was told, "It's not written anywhere, that's just how we do it." ( I thought that was a bad answer and felt as though I had been cheated!)

If I were you I would write both my ACP and the payroll people with your understanding of how the systems works. If they write back that your understanding is correct, you can probably take that to the bank. I'd figure that they are not likely to put themselves on report after they emailed you what you wanted to hear (after all, you have it in writing now!).

I don't recall reading anything in the contract on the subject, seems like an oversight to me.

Hope this helps ...

Regards,

Mark

Assumption, you do not have a traing slot for F/O now. Kind of tricky but you will get first year pay for the first year. After that if you have bid a seat and are awarded it; you will get passover if the company trains (and activates) someone junior to you before they train you.

That would mean a new hire would have to start F/O school before you but after the bid closes.

Bottomline don't count on too many months of passover. You will probably be scheduled for training fairly early and they will most likely fill up the summer classes with people on property as to opposed to new hires. If otherwise, it will be (poorly) explained in the bid letter.

Once you start getting passover pay for a seat, make sure you keep that seat in your standing bid for all subsequent bids for as long as you expect to get the passover pay. Even if you know you'll get a higher choice on the next bid, still keep the passover pay seat in your list. Real important for someone going to an LCA or Flex job for 18 months+.

Not trying to poke Mark in the eye...but don't be Mayday on this one. Don't bid an FE position ahead of 727 FO. And always keep 727 FO on your standing bid. Have it ahead or behind any other aircraft, it doesn't matter for passover pay before or after the next bid. There are some finer points if you haven't upgraded before the bid in 2008 (the one after the upcoming bid). If you change your bid in 2008 waiting for MD 11 FO class scheduled per the training letter generated by the 2007 bid, you could lose passover. Odds are you will be an FO by then, but who knows with age 60 and the economy.

In any case you should talk with the person to go to on this. Contact Marynelle Taylor. She's in the global. She will tell you not to put FE on your bid. She will help you figure out your bid order to keep your passover.

Contrary to popular belief, the company doesn't want to cheat you on passover. They just don't make it easy to figure out whether or not it is coming. Marynelle knows all. If she makes a promise, it most likely has to be honored.

Thank you all for the answers. I do not have 727 FE as a bid choice. I have 727 FO as a bid choice behind my wide body bids.

I will contact Marynell (thanks Gunter).

A-V,

Would you mind sending a PM or posting what you find out? There are quite a few of us newbies with the exact same question.

Thanks,
Z

This one is worth calling everyone you can. The company, union and all your friends. Then, go to the contract and scour it to be sure what you've been told holds up to what you read. Then come back here and tell us what you find out. Good luck.

I was in the exact same position as you. I never held B727 F/o but got the F/O -NB pay after 1st year. The only way you won't get it is if you had a possibility to bid F/o in basic indoc and you didn't take it, make sure that you do have 727F/o in your standing bid ahead of 727S/O.

This is from the e-mail that I got from the company (obviously with the personal info removed)
CREWPAY:

This information is for your files only. No retro pay required for this request:


Name: ******
Emp #: ******
Current Seat: 27SM
Passover Seat: 27FM

Pay From: *****(First Day
of Bidmonth
Until: Activation

PAYROLL:

This crewmember needs to be set up for passover pay on a monthly basis beginning the **** bidmonth.

CREWMEMBER:

You should receive your passover pay and new pay rate on your
**** 15th check. Be sure to look at your Pilot Recap Sheet in
Vips to check your pay rate on ***** 15th to make sure it changed. I don't have access to that screen.

If you have any questions regarding this matter, please contact me via phone or email.

Thank You.
Mary Nelle

Also just to add to the information. If you go directly to a wide body seat you're protected (ie you don't have to repay the passover). This has already been done.
If you bid ANC MD11 and some nuggets get activated prior to you, it will trigger WB-F/O passover.
Another piece to that puzzle, if you bid ANC MD11 and get a training date, but then bid to another domicle in the MD11 before you get to training, you'll keep your original training date and get a lateral transfer date and your passover won't be affected.

Hope that didn't muddy the water too much.

Any updates?

what else do you want to know?

This situation has happend to SEVERAL class in the past couple years and I can personally attest you will get passover even if you don't train to the 727F/O seat, just follow the things in my prior post. (you didn't pass on an F/O slot in indoc, you have 727F/O in your standing bid, you have 727F/O in front of 727S/O or DC10S/O - and I doubt that you can hold DC10s/o anyway - it VERY senior). If not Mary Nelle is very easy to talk to.

Just to tie up the loose ends for us short bus riders...

Do you have to bid 72 s/o?

Do you have to contact anyone or should this happen automatically?

If you want to bid WB, that must be first, naturally, and somewhere after, 72 f/o. This will trigger passover, assuming you never were given the option for 72 f/o during training?

Thanks

My understanding is you do not have to bid 727 SO, but if you do, it must be at a lower bid priority than 727 FO.

Lots of folks talk in the hub or ask their buds to try and figure this thing out. Both of which I think are bad ideas. The only way to guarantee good info is to talk to or e-mail Marynelle. She is the one who generates and sends the notice to pay to start your passover. I believe ACPs and everyone else get their info from her.

I would not put SO anywhere on your bid. You are already an SO. They won't take it away from you.

BTW, you will only get passover with newhires junior to you in a better seat in certain circumstances. By starting newhire class between bids you are considered to have been a part of the last bid. Any newhire junior to you going to a higher seat will trigger passover after the one year mark, IF you did not turn down an FO position during indoc.

The reason is you are considered to have bid FO in the last bid (even though you weren't here yet) and it "should" have been offered to you in newhire class if any slots were still available. Giving out all the FO slots early is not optimal. The company wants to space out FO training as FO's go to MD and Airbus school AND encourage you to go to widebody FO instead of 727 FO on the next bid.
This helps the company keep manning semi-normal and will minimize training costs.

Bid 72 FO! Anything above that is gravy and you might hold it, but if you don't bid the FO seat you won't get passover from new hires going to the right seat. If you want widebody passover (purple nuggets) you need to bid ANC MD-11 FO. The only downside is be prepared to go to that seat for training if they decide to send you and also the possibility that you will be in that seat for at least a year or more.

Good luck, we're all counting on you.

Do you have to bid 72 s/o? You should already have a 727s/o award (what you got in indoc) so no you don't have to put it in. But if you elect to stay on the panel (ie don't put in anything in the standing bid - leave it as a 999) you won't get the pay.

Do you have to contact anyone or should this happen automatically? It automatically happened for me. Mary Nelle T. sent me the e-mails as well as Pat D. But if you're still worried, go talk to Lisa, Ron M or any other FOA and they'll get you started in the right direction.

If you want to bid WB, that must be first, naturally, and somewhere after, 72 f/o. This will trigger passover, assuming you never were given the option for 72 f/o during training? You are correct sir. My last standing bid was MD11, A300, 727f/o. I was awarded the 11 and got the passover but only NB passover since I didn't bid ANC.