boeingdvr

Upgrade dipped to 2.5 years last summer. However- now all the 767’s are on line and the growth has stopped. The last award is at 3 years.

Given there are nearly 1100 FO’s on the list. I would say a new hire would upgrade on the 767 in 7-8 years.

Whaledriver101

After 12 yrs as an FO on the Classic and -400 its really comical the "newbys" *****ing about a 3 yr upgrade !!

Got news for you "new guys". Just learn what you can. More than likely,,after 2-3 yrs as an FO on a -400. Come time to upgrade,, your not going to know "what the hell your doing anyway" !!!

boeingdvr

No complaint. The fact is, it is very hard to get completely comfortable around this place anyway. A 3 year captain would be very green.

The simple point, if you’re looking to come here to upgrade, you make want to reconsider your decision.

Globemaster2827

Mine was at 5.5 years, but I'll say this about the new hires... They're not coming with plans to be working at Atlas in 12 years. They're coming to leave as soon as possible with a Type that puts their resume to the top. Part of their getting their resume to the top is upgrading. That upgrade time looks like its about to increase. There are better ways to get PIC than at Atlas right now...

RyeMex

I’ve been saying this for about 6 months, at least. I’m a 3rd year FO, and I am at the very least 18months away from an upgrade. Possibly another 2 years. And it’s going to keep climbing.

scrupulous

Why aren't the Atlas CA's and FO's moving on? Are we somehow tainted now in the industry or has hiring in general slowed up the food chain?

There was bragging on these forums that 50+ year old captains were moving on to UPS and FedEx and now we speak of no upgrades for FO's. I'm getting whiplash.

DC8DRIVER

An average of 200 Atlas pilots (out of 1700) are moving on to greener pastures every year - including a significant number of captains.

Just because there are still pilots at Atlas, don't think for a minute that any of them like the way things are. All the remaining Atlas pilots (and all of the Atlas managers) know what the situation really is: Atlas pilots are operating under a contract that hasn't been properly updated with meaningful negotiations for almost twenty years. The work rules are arcane, ambiguous, & skewed heavily in the company's favor, the benefits are dismal, the retirement almost non-existant, and the pay suffers from bottom-of-the-barrel hourly rates and virtually no soft pay or guarantee protections.

Plenty of pilots have posted first year pay on APC and yet there are still new hires that are amazed that their pay can be so low for the work they perform.

So we try to get the word out to potential Atlas pilots to do their homework and sift through the constant banter to find the truth about life as an Atlas pilot.

The info is here to find.

JonnyKnoxville

With the bottom 1,000 pilots on the seniority list having only been at Atlas for less than 48 months, I would say most here are way underestimating how long the upgrade will be.

Anyone who has been a First Officer trapped in the right seat with no upgrade in sight can pretty much tell a consistent story about what things were like at their airline before they got there.

WhaleWrangler

This is sad to see. It looks just like K4 a few years back. We were loosing pilots in numbers, 1 or 2 or even zero showing up for new hire. We even lost many good pilots to Atlas with the alure of quick upgrades, better pay and conditions and a contract before K4 woukld ever see one. We now know that to be the opposite. Only one I think has upgraded and the kicker is they are making less than an FO at K4 (although would be mid list CA at K4) if they stayed!! That's not right for one minute.



I am not sure how you are combating the situation but when K4 pilots stopped taking OT trips and worked within the bounds of the old CBA eventually the company saw the light and negotiated in good faith. They have since realized the value in what was achieved and there is even talk that they want to open negotiations late this year for our contract renewal next year.


I know Atlas pilots have the support of myself and many others but as many have said in other posts / threads it seems management don't either care, clueless or both. But I also have to ask what is the draw for new hires there given the working conditions etc? Maybe the "flow through" to Brown, I know of many that ended up at Brown after a short time.

I hope that you can get what you are deserve and quickly.

JonnyKnoxville

Classy post...thank you sir.