Why aren't you demanding accuracy in the discussion of this part of the contract??? You seem to realize that the Company isn't required to rebuild the pairing even if flown only by reserves. Misinformation doesn't serve this group for any section of the contract. Dial down the emotion and discuss this sect factually. Also... I've never advocated a different system, all my posts are still available...show me where I've misrepresented the contents of the contract.

If the disputed pairing is flown only by pilots on Reserve, the SIG can continue to dispute it.....and, I think it sends a strong message to the company that we support the SIG and don't want to do: 4 legs in the critical period (27); push 8 in 24 or a min rest in YYC (30).

I don't know how the flow went for the 27 this month, but, I know my fellow bus FOs flew pretty much all the DP versus letting them be filled by folks on Reserve.

One thing every DP has in common, they are all Contractually legal.....So, I guess it's amazing to me how many folks are upset the company is cranking the optimizer towards contractual limits when we have a ton of pilots on the property who see no problem in flying a DP.

Exactly, how is the SIG supposed to put the brakes on when they tell the company a pairing is fatiguing and potentially unsafe and one of the "bro's" flys it voluntarily?



See 25.BB.E through G.
But most imprtantly 25.BB.F.1.c

I have a buddy who has been stuck with two of the 72 disputed pairings this month(on reserve). When he got back he slept over 15hrs to get caught up

One thing every DP has in common, they are all Contractually legal.....So, I guess it's amazing to me how many folks are upset the company is cranking the optimizer towards contractual limits when we have a ton of pilots on the property who see no problem in flying a DP.

Exactly, how is the SIG supposed to put the brakes on when they tell the company a pairing is fatiguing and potentially unsafe and one of the "bro's" flys it voluntarily?



So here's the deal, we're screwing ourselves by flying these things. If you're new and don't have a clue that's one thing but if you're flying these things because it helps your "quality of life" then you're an independent contractor better off at JB. I spent three years on the SIG and I can say that there was nothing more frustrating than fighting for a pairing change because it was fatiguing and then having TF and JW come back and say that the particular pairing the previous month was picked up 10 minutes after open time was published. DON'T FLY THESE THINGS!! If you have a bud that does then get in their face and give them sh!t about it. It hurts all of us, junior or senior.

My point is we've let too many incorrect statements cloud this issue. Sorry, but even your first statement is in error. Once disputed, the SIG can continue the dispute until resolved or withdrawn without regard to whether the pairing was flown by reserves. Remember, we are talking contractually. Let's try to understand what's in our contract first, then we can discuss going beyond because the system is being optimized.

I don't think the "ISSUE" is cloudy for anyone, but you.

The important "ISSUE", is how to get the company to stop building pairings that our SIG considers bad enough to dispute. Every part of the contract dealing with the resolution of disputed pairings, whether it be by a neutral or the VP Flt Ops/MEC Chair, talks about gathering facts. Now, what facts do you think they're gathering?

I believe two important facts that might help our case would include:

1) Nobody picking up these trips from open time.
2) All the SIG Trip/Pairing Feedback Forms from each reserve or management pilot that had to fly these trips.

We don't have a leg to stand on if we voluntarily fly these trips.

The following is copied from our own SIG Committee's web page at ALPA.org. Why do you think they thought it important enough to quote on the linked page: Disputed Pairings Explained?

The PSIT takes the issue of pairing disputes very seriously. Pairings are not disputed because the PSIT considers them to be merely “inconvenient.” A pairing will be disputed when identified by the FEDEX MEC as having been constructed with unsafe, onerous, or otherwise objectionable flying. The contractual procedures and handling of pairing disputes is outlined in the SIG letter of agreement in your Contract. An excerpt from the side letter: “Additionally, if on a recurring basis, a pairing, disputed or not, appears in open time and is routinely avoided by pilots trip trading or eligible for make-up, OTP, etc., and therefore must be assigned to a reserve pilot, the above procedure shall apply.” The “above procedure” referenced by the excerpt, would refer the disputed pairing to the Scheduling Dispute Board for resolution.

If you still think voluntarily flying DP's doesn't harm the process. You truly are a moron.

Yes.

From the SIG committee's page "Disputed pairings explained":

As a reminder, once open time is released, you can then get one of these disputed pairings by:

o Voluntary: Specifically requesting a disputed pairing (by number) on a secondary or custom line.
o Voluntary: Putting “volunteer for general trips” or “general make-up” in as a request and then being assigned a disputed pairing in open time.
o Voluntary: Requesting a trip trade into a disputed pairing.
o Voluntary: Accepting VLT/DRF into a disputed pairing.
o Involuntary: Reserve-an option the Company always retains for the operation of any legally-constructed pairing. This assignment is involuntary and may not be turned down.

Open Mind.....I have been following your postings and I can't figure out weather you are being deliberately obtuse or are the intellectual equivalent of a bag of hammers. If the DP is flown by non reserves for 3 bid periods then it becomes non-disputable (25-58E.1). I.E THE SIG CAN NO LONGER DISPUTE IT. Before posting any further, please do your homework and at least be factually correct in your statements. Opinions are our own and debateable, but when related to incorrect contract quotes or cites they carry no water. Good luck in your research.

Wow, Thanks Busboy I would not have got that from only reading the contract. I would never use general make-up anyway....too many undesireable trips out there.

Here's another example...please read the agreement!!! If the DP is flown for 3 bid periods (not by reserves... by any pilot...if it operates at all) it becomes non-disputable. So when the Company comes up with a new sequence SFS-HKG-ALA the SIG has 3 bid periods to dispute before its too late. I do my homework and try to be as factually correct as I can... although I am a bag of hammers. The MEC has decided its not their job to educate the crew force on the contract. BTW, I haven't given an opinion lately. Good luck in you research.