New ACP's
 

The FCIF about the new ACP's seem to indicate that our ACP is determined by our last name. Is this Right?

Yep. It's a new idea from the big "O".

Rumor has it.....
 

Divided the pilots up by alphabet and assigned each group to an ACP. Still waiting for the cubicle commandos to communicate the change to the crew force. Guess if you want to work for the SCP you have to come from the schoolhouse. Nuthin like understanding intimately what it's like to fly the line full time when you are considering disciplinary steps against a pilot............

Or from the Union :confused:

Your statement makes it seem like you think that guys who come from the schoolhouse haven't flown the line or don't have an intimate understanding of line flying. Personally, I flew the line for 10 years before taking a job as a flex. Getting hired for any position in management or training puts the individual through a thorough screening process, during which any number of things, including just one negative input from another manager or LCA, can preclude being hired. Knowing this, it might make it a bit clearer why pilots who are already LCA/Flex instructors are sometimes more easily placed in management jobs. Not to mention the obvious fact that guys who are willing to do the extra work and have proven themselves over time to be strong performers in the training arena make them obvious choices over an unknown entity (who might be equally qualified, BTW.)

Put yourself in SJ's shoes and decide for yourself who you'd hire...a guy you had worked with who had an established reputation; who had been endorsed by guys you knew and respected, or an unknown line pilot whom you had never heard anything about.

The ABCs of ACPs! I didn't get one, yet!

Lets help the job security of flight managers. Lets all start changing our names.

Not sure who you are, MEMA300, but it's obvious you know me. :) In any case, I agree with you that those in management or training who are there forever are prone to losing touch with reality, but still disagree with "hamfisted" insinuating that those in training or management positions do not have intimate knowledge of line flying.
His references were:

1. That you have to come from the schoolhouse to work for the SCP, and;

2. "Nuthin like understanding intimately what it's like to fly the line full time when you are considering disciplinary steps against a pilot............"

That sarcasm was read loud and clear and I think it's (expletive deleted at moderators request). He's implying that those who reach positions of responsibility in training or management don't have an intimate understanding of line flying...although I can't deny that there are some who fit that mold...And I understand your point about the incestuous nature of management. I don't agree with it, but I understand why it is. That is what I was discussing here.

Word during my CMV1 from my current ACP is that this alphabetic move is to create continuity so that you don't change ACPs everytime you change planes or seats.

What if you change your name? :rolleyes:

The big issue that I see with this move is that I might be reporting to someone that doesn't operate the same machine I do. These guys are chronically out of touch anyway, but now he (or God forbid she) won't be able to relate in any way. These are the kinds of decisions that keep me from taking managers or senior leadership (and I use that term VERY loosely) seriously.

Age 65 (ahem) can't get here fast enough.

I was told when I got hired here by a good friend that FedEx is the land of "change for the sake of change." He was right.

A quick review of the current ACPs will result in the finding that EVERY new ACP hired since OR and SJ assumed their respective positions came from "non-line-flying" jobs. OR came from the schoolhouse after being there for a long time. SJ came from the schoolhouse after being there for a long time. BH used to be in charge of Bus training in the schoolhouse, went back to being a flex and then migrated to an ACP position. LK came from the position as Grievance Committee Chairman for the Union. PD has been an ACP for over 5 years.
No personal attacks on any of them. How familiar are they with what it's like to fly the kind of "optimized" schedules we are flying now?

"Put yourself in SJ's shoes and decide for yourself who you'd hire...a guy you had worked with who had an established reputation; who had been endorsed by guys you knew and respected, or an unknown line pilot whom you had never heard anything about."

I personally would make sure a got a cross-section of the pilots I am supposed to be managing and dealing with. That would require me to go outside the group of people I was comfortable with and actually take a chance on an "unknown line pilot" whom I had never heard about. He obviously had been doing his job earning his paycheck doing what the vast majority of us do here. Fly the freight full time. I'll take my chances with him if I call in sick or fatigued.

I understand your point, and I think it has merit, but I think where we differ is that I believe that all the people you mention did, at one time in their career at FedEx, fly the line full time...for years. If they have lost touch with that part of their profession, and it negatively affects their ability to be good decision-makers, then shame on them. In the end, all management, regardless of their roots, is ultimately tempted by the dark side of the force...it's the personality, character, and qualifications of the individual that count, not where they came from immediately preceding their hiring into a management positon.:)

Again subic, I am not personally attacking any of the folks who work in management. As a line pilot with no experience doing anything but flying the line full time, I have no desire to do anything else.
I strongly feel though that a group of ACPs, an RCP and an SCP who have not flown the line full time for more than 5 years is at great risk of not relating to or having credibility with the line pilots they represent, discipline and manage. Their integrity, professionalism and honesty have nothing to do with losing touch with what most of us do for a living, especially under "optimized" schedules.
I stand by my original satement you felt was too harsh which was, " Guess if you want to work for the SCP you have to come from the schoolhouse.(name one he's hired who hasn't) Nuthin like understanding intimately what it's like to fly the line full time when you are considering disciplinary steps against a pilot."(things have changed an awful lot in the last 5 years for line pilots, don't you agree?)

The reason you stand out is there are so few in flex who have that much line experience under their belt. Easy to figure out.

Ok, I think I understand you now. In order to help management relate to the pilot group, you're suggesting 5 year term limits for flight management, right? This concept has been tossed around before and I think it too has merit.

Line pilots should not be able to hide out in non-line flying jobs for the majority of their career. If you dont want to be a line pilot give up your number. I think after five years of not being on the line you should have to go back to the line for five years. Of course management would never agree to this. It would not allow them to keep their people in place.

I think the desire to have a line dog in the ACP slots is a good one, but unrealistic. Someone has to flex, DO, MEC, ACP, etc... These positions take a significant number of pilots. The career non-line dogs are probably 80-90% of applicants for management. They want to drive cubicles. I don't want that job and I don't know a lot of pilots who do. The career desk drivers should drive desks and we would have a safer airline.

Who gets spanked the hardest?
 

Scenario: A three (wo)man crew has their collective heads up and locked. They do something stupid or make an honest mistake. They get the call to have a visit with their ACP. The captain has a last name that starts with A, the f/o's starts with L and the rfo/engineer's starts with Z. The captain's ACP fires him, the f/o gets 2 weeks of without pay and the rfo/engineer gets a slap on the wrist and buys his ACP a cup of coffee because they flew together someplace years ago.

What a plan.

Sounds stupid to me too. When I call my ACP I want to talk to someone who relates to my job not my last name. Right now I call the MD-11 ACP he knows what I'm talking about he's been there and done it. Of course we are lucky right now to have a pilot for an ACP and not someone who has been hiding in the training dept or out on sick leave but stays in the training dept. Can't wait to call from China/Europe or anywhere away from Memphis and talk to the old 727 S/O guy to get some answers.
By the time he calls to get some answers from S.M. it will be too late.

If there's a fireable type offense pending, I don't think the decision to give a guy his walking papers is made at the mid-level ACP position. SCP, lawyers, and personnel get involved. So the guy handing out the discipline is just a hatchet man. Apologies to fecav8r, but: makes me wonder why anyone would want to be the remote controlled bearer of bad news.

In the end, the place needs a manager interface. I, for one, am GLAD that at least we have a pilot, vice a suit, doing the job. As for the cross-qualified ACP (727 qual-ed ACP reviewing an A300 Captain): if the call on the carpet was aircraft specific, standards has enough input with the enhanced oversight program to address this. I could care less if my ACP is qual-ed on my A/C. Sure, it might take a couple of minutes to explain how things came about. Org diagrams, and reporting funcions aren't my thing, I'm a line dog. When they decide to put a non-pilot suit in the ACP job (call it what you will), THEN I'll worry.

And of course they all called the union FIRST before showing up for that ACP meeting, right? And brought their own union representative with them? That would help with "equal" discipline.

If you have to go see an ACP for a "stupid or honest mistake," call the union. It is not confrontational or anti-management to do this. It is to protect yourself, and have someone on your side that can see the situation objectively. Most management guys are in the union, anyway, and will support you bringing a rep. It is your right.

When I upgraded from right to left seat in the Mad Dog we did a series of events involving Subic. Our instructor had never been there................

While I agree that sometimes "having been there, done that..." is important, I don't think training scenarios or simulator admin is one of them. Most guys have never had a V1 cut either, doesn't mean they can't teach it in the sim. If a guy can get across the knowledge you need to know, then he's done his job.

I can understand the chagrin about having long time training guys fill the management positions, as something about it doesn't quite "feel right." It'd be nice to see an outsider type get involved, if in fact there are any that actually want to. In the meanwhile, though, nearly all of the training guys I've met have been good dudes who have our best interests in mind and who also KNOW they've got to fight a little bit harder for that street cred they need. I really don't think we'll notice one hiccup or speed bump in the road with these guys in charge.

I like the new system, as a matter of fact since senority has nothing to do with the way our block reps vote, maybe we should switch to the alphabet for determining what block we are in. :eek:

Now that I think about, since the union just seems to be a rubber stamp, maybe our ACPs can double as block reps.

Can I still change my vote for this ACP thingy?

I am sure that Captains wont mind having discipline handed out by an ACP that is an FO.:rolleyes:

I would submit that if they do, it's THEIR problem...

Yeah but he probably would be trained/qualed as one from being a flex so it is ok.

Why do we have ACPs that are not checked out as Capt. Don't all have the seniority to be Capt.

In the -10 community we've had an APC who was neither a captain nor DC-10 guy. It didn't seem to matter much. If he had a technical question he'd call the standards office. Besides it's the flight ops specialists that really run the ACP office. IIRC, there may be an FAA reg that states that ACPs must be pilots. I know that's true for chief pilot and VP ops, I think the same applies to ACPs.

ACP is a corporate req. position, not an faa mandated position. Chief pilot, D.O. I think are the faa positions that require a pilot.

If an ACP has the seniority to hold a Capt. position he should checkout. If he does not it shows lack of leadership and a lack of credibility.

All ACPs should have to fly a disputed pairing if they have them in their airplane.

ACP should fly trips that they can hold rather than the cream puff trips. (same with alpa leadership)

ACPs, flexs and all non-line type pilots need to have a 5 year limit on office duty before doing another 5 years on the line.
(same with alpa leadership)

The new ACP format is out. I got the worst draw. DM:mad:

There is the rub. Most line guys know they have the best job and would never leave that to sit in a cubicle. Supply and demand.

If you are an attorney that specializes in name changes, we have an ambulance for you to chase.

We knew it was too good to be true that he was going back to the line. :(

I think this should be a cornerstone of our next contract.
It's often we complain of the "guy" that hasn't flown the line since he first checked out as a Capt. From Flex to duty officer to LEC/MEC member to management to Flex to LCA to .... Look how out of touch our MEC is because they haven't been a regular line guy in years. Look how out of touch the idea of flying a DP is to our mgmt. (However I do appreciate the effort to fly DP's just wish they'd fly the entire pairing). This would protect everyone.

Where's Len?
 

Where's Len?

New FCIF about ACP's says Len will do "special projects."

HAHA Been there done that... Got the best draw.. I think?? SM

Does that mean that is the muted voice you hear when your standing tall in O's ofice? :eek:

Past....

I thought Mr. Sick policy was on his way out and was in the running for negotiating chairman?