So how did you get past the online App and the requirement for the FEXw that "it" thinks you must have?

I put the date of the FEX in and it took it.

The best thing to do is get the "official" word from HR at the company or have a friend do it to find out what the "requirement du jour" is. My most recent online app was submitted last March, thus by the time your new submission goes in, the rules will have probably changed again.

Good luck

Ok. Here is a little mud for the waters. I am in the pool, however my FE Written expires in November. Am I gonna have to retake it?

I would wait and see. When you get the call they will let you know.

And that was an "expired" date for the FEXw? I passed the FEXw once, but it was 20 years ago and I never had to get the certificate. July '85 I believe. I lost the printout from the FAA. Would that be good enough?

A bit of both. Let me explain this politician answer <g>. It is really not a one for one comparison. It has to do with payload and flying time. Give you a real example of 3 efficiences UPS has attained in the last 8 years.

Birmingham (BHM), AL used to have a DC-8 that flew BHM-SDF-BHM Monday through Friday. Additionally, they had a 727 fly BHM-CAE (Columbia, SC)-BHM Monday through Friday. It took 6 crewmembers a night to fly the revenue out of BHM. SDF couldn't handle all the volume anyway.

Efficieny 1: Teamsters contract 97 gave UPS 'team drivers" which allowed UPS the ability to close much of the Friday night air lift requirment because it now went on a truck that drives with 2 drivers 24 hours a day nonstop (except gas and drop and hook). Reduced crew member requirments.

Efficiency 2: UPS bought the A-300 that carried the volume of a DC-8 and a 727.

Efficiency 3: UPS built Worldport that could handle so much more volume (it is expanding again at present).

Gained: Remove DC-8 and 727 from BHM and the 6 crew members a night 5 days a week requirment (2 aircraft and 30 crewmembers days required weekly) to a single A-300 with 2 crew members 5 days a week (10 crewmember days required weekly) flying BHM-SDF-BHM because the airplane and SDF could handle all the volume. A reduction of one airframe and a big drop in required crew members.

Going Forward: UPS still combines routes etc. when able. Some A-300/DC-8 routes being planned to be replaced by the MD-11 that can handle the mean volume of both combined on certain routes.
767's not publicly stated to replace the DC-8, but a 767 could replace a half full nightly DC-8 and half full nightly 757 that are close enough on a route and still make the sort times. In this case, the dissappearing DC-8 does not to be replaced. An example I will pull out of the air. JAN (757) and TYS (DC-8) could be replaced by a single 767 flying JAN-TYS-SDF. This would free up a 757 for another market and not require a DC-8 anymore.

Simple really. We still have supervisors 'managers' whose job is to check FE's. How would they justify their jobs to ATL if there no longer was a written requirment requiring there services by oncoming pilots? So you are helping preserve jobs until no DC-8's are left <ng>, that is all. BTW, I was working as an F/O at a 121 carrier and was hired 2 years after my FE written expired. HR said I did not need to retake the written, FSDO just validated it upon my arrival to train as an S/O. I think they would still accept that, the software likely does not recognize this condition. Would have to track down someone in HR for the most recent 'policy'.

Makes sense, because looking at the UPS new hire training history in an earlier post, there were no new hire engineers trained the past several years. Are some of the current engineers seat locked with pay protection while new hires go straight to F/O seats in order to save training costs?

Good example! Wouldn't BHM only require 4 days per week due to Efficiency #1, the weekend trucking? That would reduce the need to 8 crewmember days per week from the 30...

(Correction) I looked up BHM, and they do fly the 5th day after all. It seems that they would be close enough to truck it up and back over the weekend, but maybe there is another factor that keeps that from happening.

Most of the current FEs are over 60 years old and hired in the 1990s. In other words, more senior on the list than the average new hire. So no pay protection required to hire into the right seat.

As a matter of fact, after a year at UPS, I couldn't even hold an FE spot. No one is being held on the panel against their bidding seniority, that I am aware of ... Of course not counting the over 60 folks waiting for a vacancy to move forward ;)

There were some new hire classes of F/E's in late 2006 on the 727 and DC-8. Some of those "new hires" are getting ready to go to long term training for the third time in less than a year and a half when this next displacement comes out.

Fex
 

That would depend. The exemption specifies that in order to maintain the currency of the FEX, you would have to maintain continuous employment as a pilot at a 121 carrier from a date prior to the expiration date of your FEX. For example, if you took the written in 1998, and were employed by Carrier X from that point until today, the written is still current per the FAA, should you be taking a checkride for your FE Certificate. Now, say you left Carrier X, then was hired by Carrier Y after a 5 day lapse in employment, you would have to retake the written.

You will have to have the original FEX test report, or an official copy, which the FAA will grant you if you contact OKC, as you will need to provide this at your interview (at least I did). You will need to check with the FAA to see whether or not your written falls under the exemption, depending on when the exemption reg was written. When I filled out my brown app, it asked for the exact date I took the exam. Basically, it is your responsibility to determine whether or not your written is current, and your local FSDO or OKC can advise you on this. Personally, since it's been so long, I would probably retake it to make brown happy.

Hope this helps. You can knock out the written in a day or two with Lone Eagle Seminars - they have an excellent online course, and average score is a 98.

Expiration
 

If you are employed by a 121 carrier, then no. If not, then I would contact HR and see what they would like you to do. My guess is probably not, but that is only a guess. :rolleyes:

You're right. That's probably the best and easiest way to take care of it considering all the currency requirements. Thanks for the info. JP

No prob. Good luck!

mtnbiker.....................Jun 05
Larcifer........................Mar 06
ToBeOrNotToBe.............Nov 06
johnnypilot12...............Jun 07
crjav80r.......................Jul 07
water skr......................Jul 07
flybouy.........................Aug 07
flynfr8..........................Aug 07
FIIGMO........................Sep 07
motojet........................Sep 07
skymarz.......................Sep 07
Cpt. Bat.......................Oct 07
Moondog......................Oct 07
Barney1.......................Nov 07
Harley..........................Nov 07
beernuts......................Dec 07
ERJ Jay........................Dec 07
low and slow................Dec 07
talon 757.....................Dec 07

Added johnnypilot12 to the list.

I've been reading the UPS Realignment Bid Results thread and admit I don't understand a lot of what is being discussed. Any updated thoughts on how all of this might effect the poolies now that the realignment bid is posted?

Thanks for helping us poolies to keep the faith.

Hey, I work here. And I have no idea how this will affect future hiring.

SORRY ...

If anyone actually knows the answer to that, I'd like to borrow their crystal ball for a day !

Good Luck and keep the faith !

Brown CC

It's not good...

Hiring occurs when there are unfilled vacancies from a system bid. Are there currently any unfilled vacancies? No, but a bid is still active. Don't expect any however except possibly DC-8 S/O later this year.

Do we expect any hiring in the near-term? Probably not. Given that UPS wants to reduce the crew ratio to 3/1 and 6/1 Dom/Int'l, it doesn't look too promising in the near-term for poolies. Alot will depend on when we announce some new aircraft acquisitions. Tough time to be swimming but one never knows around here. Good luck.

Harley, there are many variables that no one knows the outcome too and how it will affect the crew force as it currently stands. Some of those issues are, open skies, new airplane acqu, retirement of current aircraft, the US dollar, world package volume, etc... I hope things improve so that you and the rest of the poolies get the call; sooner than later.

I'm trying CC and others, thanks. I do feel lucky to be in the pool instead of waiting for the application window to open again however. :)

There are a lot of variables Shaggy I know. During my interview I asked about a replacement for the canceled A-380s, if there is anything they could share with me about plans for a replacement aircraft. The company had obviously identified a need for a lot of additional lift and now the order was canceled. Pam deferred to Buz and I thought that what he said was an announcement about additional aircraft would be made in the near future. He also said to expect little to no hiring in '08.

Now with the cost of fuel what it is and the downturn in the economy maybe the need isn't there anymore. I don't know but it sure seems to me that that was an awful lot of lift that has gone unfilled.

I wish you guys and gals the best with the bids.

unfilled by IPA pilots, yes, but totally unfilled, we will never know.

SCOPE


:eek:



Don't get that started in this thread ...



:p

:D