AStar TA!!!
 

Congratz....

Good luck guys!

awesome, guys, hope it's an overall solid improvement to your current contract.

Congratulations. You guys deserve a good contract. Looking forward to more news...oldfr8dog.

Awww Jim, c'mon, be happy.

BTW, ever get over that alarm clock issue you were having?

Congrats and sincere Best Wishes!

Yes, as a matter of fact I did. Have you? If not, this should help...

Current local time in Memphis - Tennessee - U.S.A.

Great! Glad to hear that!

Now if you could just get the Feds to give back your certificates........

What does any of this have to do with the T/A?

Better yet, what does "my" business have to do with YOU?

If you want to talk stink about other crewmembers, at least show a little testicular fortitude, eh? Contact "me" directly, or via the ALPA 917 message board. You have the URL, and you just might learn something.

Oops, I forgot. You're not "anonymous" over there.

Never mind....

retro vs bonus...
 

Uh, Jim, it's ALPA 017. And I can't "contact" you there because you were fired from the company........remember?

Hope this clarifies things.

Have a nice day, OK? :D

Congratulations! Did DHL/ASTAR management dangle the 767-300's and ABX Air jobs to get your MEC to sign the TA? Wow, your MEC even gave up the scope lawsuit. Ah, the power of the mighty dollar.......

Wow! You guessed it! The cat's out of the bag now.:rolleyes:

Congrats on the TA....I hope you like what your negotiation committee has delivered.

???????????? :mad: :( :confused:

Dude, it's not concessionary, no guarantee of 767's, or ABX Air jobs. We did drop scope litigation and we got something more concrete in return. ABX Air is not, and was not mentioned either as a carrot or a stick. Lemme know when yall informational picket to secure something for yourself, and I'll be there to hold a sign.

We have pending scope litigation, we're flamed. We drop pending scope litigation, we're flamed. The good news is, now that we've dropped it, I guess DHL can contract with ABX Air all they want. Sooo, have a drink on me!

Cheers!:cool:

So what "more concrete" language did you get?


Some see a signing bonus as concessionary. They would like to know what you were promised that made a signing bonus worthwhile. They are naturally concerned that your new more concrete scope will now have an adverse affect on their jobs.

A. As much as I'd like to indulge that question, I'll refrain because it's not really any of your biz until my MEC decides to announce it publicly. Suffice it to say it has nothing to do with ABX and only addresses the future of AStar pilots. Since it's OUR contract, and it's not concessionary, i.e. it's a move forward, once you know what the company agreed to, hopefully YOUR negotiators will be able to secure the same or better for you.

B. While "some" might see a signing bonus as concessionary, what really matters is what my ALPA brethren see it as, and vote on. Truly, you will in time have a chance to view our TA/Contract and make your own determination as to whether you think it was good enough. In nearly ever aspect it was a move forward.

While I recognize that rising tides lift all, my definition of a rising tide might simply be seen as neep by you or others. I don't really feel the need to defend it to you or anyone else though.

To add to that AV8OR, it might be a real good idea to make sure that it passes, before we even bother wasting bandwith discussing it.

Agree. I think you know I'm voting yes and encouraging others to do the same. Guess we'll see.

Typically the reason a company prefers the signing bonus approach instead of "retro" pay, i think, is because they do not want to have to go back and revise the previous quarters or years financial statements. The signing bonus lets them show the costs at the time that the cost occurred, at contract signing, rather than submit a bunch of revised financials. I am not sure why so many people think it is a concession.

Congrats in the TA,

WG

It is a concession because "retro" is exactly that. They go back and make you whole for your 401K, your retirement, everything that compounds. Taking a signing bonus is a concession to the company. You have given them money to "use" free of interest for the whole time negotiations went on. It also gives them an incentive not to get the next contract done very fast either. If it will not cost them the retro they save money in the long run, hence no pressing need to get the next contract signed.

P.S.

I do not mean to say that Astar took a concessionary contract. I do not know. I have not seen what is in the TA. Please do not read this as a flame. Just trying to explain the big difference between signing bonus and retro pay. Retro is WAY, WAY better.

Most think it is a concession because you get less pay for the rest of your career, and the company saves money for the rest of your career!

Not taking it as a flame. It's clear that no matter what we do, you guys won't be happy with it. Not that I care. "Drop your scope suit!" OK, did that. "Well, what did you get for dropping it? You guys must be trying to hose us!" Huh? "Retro is better than a signing bonus." Well, duh. Given the current situation around the cornfield, if anyone thinks this TA is concessionary, they're whacked. Gains in all areas. No give backs. 'Bout all I've got to say about that.

Hvy,

Take a deep breath. Not everything is about you. I was explaining to Worldguy why people consider a signing bounus as consessionary. ABX pilots have no room to throw stones since we took a hosing in our last contract with a signing bonus, so relax, it is not always about you or Astar.

BH,

Yes, it is all about me. :) I guess I should have broken it down into two posts. To you was the part about getting that yours wasn't a flame. If you look at this entire thread though, the things I wrote about and more have been thrown our way. That's what the rest of it was about. They're all ABX posters.

Hvy,

The questions are being asked because some of your peers have been dropping sketchy details of a potentially inflammatory nature. I don't want to rehash the whole scope arguement. Suffice it to say we are both familier with the details. You have now dropped the litigation. Great, but the situation has changed. You are now, once again, argueably part of the "DHL family" since DHL has taken a 49% interest in Astar. They do not have a similar interest in ABX. We would like to know what changes were made to the language that might have an adverse impact on us, our careers, our ability to support our families. Do we need to start looking for employment elsewhere? The language may give us some idea.

As to whether or not the rest of your T/A is concessionary in nature, I really don't care. We will have to fight our own battles. I may do my own analysis based on the scanty info now available, or I may not. I may do one later when more info is out there. Depends on how bored I am and how much time I have on a layover.

That's the problem Eric, all we have are at the moment are vague sketchy details. The MEC and Neg Comm are in the process of putting together a Road Show. Until then we don't know the "devil in the details". And we all know it's in the "details" where the rubber hits the road. So until then, just hang out it the dark with us.

FAJ

BS.................

Please go attempt to commit a physically impossible unnatural act upon yourself.

Your statement suggesting retro pay requires going back and restating financials is simply not true. Don't believe everything a airline exec might tell you.

A signing bonus may not be a concession, but it doesn’t compare at all with retro pay. Most pilots make the mistake of simply comparing the size of the signing bonus check vs the size of the retro check.

What they miss is the % increase for every pay raise for the rest of their career does not get the benefit of those years you worked without getting a retro pay raise. The compounding of those years without a pay raise adds up.

I’m not dissing the Astar TA in any way, btw. Just trying to explain the difference. Congratulations to you guys on your TA

TA Passes
 

The results of the Ratification Ballot for the Amendments to the Agreement between ASTAR and ALPA have been certified by ALPA. We are pleased to announce the Amendment to the Agreements passed with the following numbers:



· 427 voters cast their ballots, 88.77% of the eligible voters

· 397 voted in favor of the ratification, 92.97%

· 30 voted against the ratification, 7.03%



This has been a tremendous turnout of voters and we would like to thank everyone that voted for making their voice heard.

Congratz....

Details please!

How does the fleet growth aspect of the contract work?

If the company is going to grow the fleet aren't they going to grow it regardless of what the contract says?

If the company doesn't want to grow the fleet how can that aspect of the contract be enforced? Is there a financial penalty if the prescribed growth does not occur?

Yes LJ. Monetary penalties if they do not purchase a/c, to be distributed to the FO's and SO's.

Oh, that's good! Makes sense now. Thanks!

How are those penalties calculated?