You are right, that was flamebate,my apologies but section 11 is consessionary,and now Dave can't figure out why the company wants more concessions.

I must have missed something. In what way is section 11 concessionary? I think you could call it non-concessionary based just on what the company DIDN'T get. No up or out, no max training failures over a lifetime and they backed off on a lot of the disciplinary measures they wanted in that section of the contract.

If I'm wrong someone please educate me.

You didn't Google "Silver Anvil" and FedEx, did you?


P - R - O - P - A - G - A - N - D - A

Fool you once, shame on them, fool you twice, shame on you.


I don't care if they budgeted a billion dollars, I don't care if they hired every available cargo airplane on the planet, I don't care if they furloughed pilots out of seniority order, I don't care what training syllabi were approved by the FSDO, I don't care how many foreign pilots were staying in the Holiday Inn Express across the street - - it was propaganda - - a bluff - - fiction - - all straight out of the pages of Union Busting 101.


Fred Smith's baby is FedEx Express. He won't destroy it for two reasons. First, because it's his baby. Second, because he has a fiduciary responsibility to the Board of Directors.


Hey, listen, I tell ya what. I know you're not a union member, so why don't you send me your name and address, and I'll send you a copy of the DVD from the last Fedex ALPA rally. There were some very informative speeches, and I think you'll be enlightened. Whadya say?






- The truth only hurts if it should -

Tony C:

Very nice, sane, understandable report!! I like it!

Not to burst the pilots bubble, but there are a lot of FDX employees that deserve and need a pay increase more than you.. You guys are kind of greedy arent you.. I've been in many positions at FDX.. I've worked my tail off for more than 10 years at FedEx.. You guys make more money in a month than I do all year.. And your threatening to strike for more money??

I remember a jumpseat I took.. I was so excited to look out the window on a gorgeous Sunday afternoon.. Leaving Memphis, the pilots decided to cover the windows with newspaper because the sun was bugging them.. So much for my view.. The only time I could see anything was when one of the pilots took a piece of newspaper down to read.. But what do ya know, he quickly replaced it with another piece of paper.. I got to sit there and look at the back of 3 heads for a several hour flight.. Pilots did not even offer me a section..

Many people would say, so much for pilots working hard.. I know better.. I know the pilot job is very stressful and you have a lot of responsibility.. But there is no way in the world you guys work harder or longer hours than the courier work force does.. You guys have it made.. You have your dream job making super amounts of money.. Are you willing to throw that away by striking for more money? How many other airlines are actually making money?

Not to mention you will be hurting the future income of every FedEx employee.. The average FedEx employee does not deserve that..

Please do not threaten a strike.. Please do not burn more fuel or burn up your tires.. Please do not throw a wrench in the day of our couriers by showing up to your destination late (on purpose) because of a BS mechanical delay..

In short, if you guys ever go on strike.. 99.9% of other FedEx employees will be rooting against you..

And dont start that "Well, if yall had a union" BS.. I dont want to hear it.. I deal with a lot of couriers.. And we have a lot of disgruntled couriers.. But I must say after reading topic after topic in this forum, our pilots are the most disgruntled group of employees at FedEx.. That is freaking ridiculous..

Most of the issues we have with management are not for more money like you said. It is about keeping promises they have already made to us, and now want to take away. These include scope, healthcare, and retirement. These issues are important to all employees. We ARE looking out for other employees becuase they deserve what we are asking for, too.

If the pilots have it so good, then become one. This isn't a communist state, we all should not make the same amount. I'm not saying we are more important or better than any other group- it wouldn't happen without everyone else. But if you don't like what you make, then do what it takes to get a job that pays you more. I did. And I did some crummy, low paying jobs to get where I am. And I would never begrudge anyone doing better than me or making more money, or think it wasn't "fair" - because it wouldn't have changed my situation. Good for them! It doesn't take away from me.

Besides, if you really are one of our dispatchers, you don't make 1/12th of what a pilot makes, like you said. I made about $8000 last month- is that your annual salary? Once they took out union dues, insurance, and taxes, I got about half of that in my 2 checks.

Sorry the jumpseat experience wasn't a positive one. When I jumpseat, I don't expect a view, and I bring my own food and reading material. And I do that even when I am a PAYING passenger on any regular airline, like NWA. Perhaps you could have asked for a section of the paper? Or asked what landmarks you were over, and asked to see it? Or perhaps the comfort of the pilots flying into the sun was all the guys were thinking of- we don't get a lot of people up front who WANT to look out, so it probably didn't register that you wanted to see out. But instead you pouted, took your toys away, and are holding a grudge. YOU could have made it a better experience, too..... No, you shouldn't have HAD to. But sometimes, doing whatever it takes to get the RESULTS that you want.... will.... get you the results that you want.

Not to burst your bubble, but you're right. I wish there was a way to get you a raise, too. I've been a courier - - I know how it works. Have you been a pilot?


If you're really interested in learning about the issues, you'll find that pay is not even in the top four "Cornerstone" issues that concern us. Work Rules, Job Security, Retirement Security, and Health Care are issues that I am sure you can agree are essential to our current and future well-being. I suggest that you browse FedEx Labor Talks to learn more.


The last thing we want is a strike. IF we do, it will be because FedEx management left us no other choice.


Thanks for your support!





- The truth only hurts if it should -

TonyC, The more of your posts I read, the more impressed I become. I can not agree with you more. I, like most of the rest of the Crewmembers at FedEx have friends who are not pilots at FedEx but do very important jobs. To me the main issue is not what I make or they make, it's what WE ALL deserve to make. I have never resented the money any of our Corporate management make, just like I don't care what the Corporate impression is of what I make. It is a matter of supply and demand. Don't mean to belittle the job that any of our fellow employees do but I would put the training required to do my job up against what is requird to do theirs any day of the week. I bet it didn't take 10 years to get to be a courier.

How many "happy FedEx campers" are wondering "what the hell happened to the People-Service-Profits mentality?" And how can a 'Best Company to Work For' continue to make record profits yet FAIL TO REWARD ITS NON-MANAGEMENT EMPLOYEES WITH ABOVE-INFLATION RAISES?

Keep drinking the Purple Kool-Aid, good luck with your retirement security and find someplace else to vent! Perhaps the "Truck Drivers aka Independent Contractors Class Action Forum" or maybe the "Kinkos Workers Brace for FedEx Inquisition Discussion Group." Leave us "disgruntled pilots" alone so we can try to hold management fiscally responsible (and you can then reap the downstream benefits)!

"Leave us disgruntled pilots alone". Get a life outside the cockpit. The "union" and your peers have convinced many pilots that FedEx management is so bad. It must to Hell to go to work with that attitude. You got it great and try making your point with the Delta and NWA pilots group. The previous post that 99.9% of the employees at FedEx Express would be on the companies side is very true