F90 operating costs
03-08-2015, 10:10 AM
#1
Gets Weekends Off
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Jun 2014
Posts: 199
F90 operating costs
Would someone be able to provide some realistic figures on all inclusive operating costs for the f90. Cost including maint. Per hour, cost per mile, fuel burn ect. What breaks frequently? What do the phase inspections cost on average. Thanks in advance for all input.
03-11-2015, 08:26 AM
#2
New Hire
Joined APC: Jun 2013
Posts: 9
I operate a 1980 F90 Part 91 and can give you a few data points. We do not fly the airplane enough for me to give you a very good total operating cost, in my opinion. It would be pretty skewed to the high side due to our low usage.
Insurance--we are just a shade under $10K a year for single-pilot, Part 91 ops. Piloting is not my primary role in the company, and I'm told by our broker that hurts us some.
Performance--I cruise in the FL200-240 range and flight plan 75gph and 260KTAS. She'll do this all day. You can get her higher, but with the stubby wing, it takes forever to get there and you are kinda hanging on the props.
Phase Inspections--This one is tough for me to pin down exactly because we almost always have some other inspection, avionics work, or some other minor thing going on at the same time, but I'd guess we average in the 8-10K range for two phase inspections per year.
What breaks--Not much. Other than recurring inspections, the T-tail inspection hole SB, and routine wear items, we have had very few issues in our almost 9 years of ownership. The 6-year gear inspections can get pricey, because, as I understand it, the F90 only shares main gear structure with the 100 series. The 200/300 gear will not interchange so you are dealing with a very small parts inventory for a very small fleet. Same with the props. We had to replace a few original blades this year because they were at their minimum thickness and it was not a fun conversation with the boss. You can get blades from Raisbeck, but they are more expensive and there is no gross weight increase STC for the F so there isn't much advantage over factory Hartzells. Look for one with recent prop overhauls and preferably new blades.
All told, it is a great airplane for our mission of hauling 3-5 people over 500-700 mile legs. It has the best electrical system of the small KAs, the 200 fuel system which is pretty much foolproof, and good speed for the cost. The boss loves the cabin, and I absolutely love to fly it. I have flown J3s to C-5s and the F is one of my favorites. It is also the sexiest King Air on the ramp in my biased opinion.
Good luck in your search. If you find a good one, you will not be disappointed. I just hope you get to fly it more than I do ours.
Insurance--we are just a shade under $10K a year for single-pilot, Part 91 ops. Piloting is not my primary role in the company, and I'm told by our broker that hurts us some.
Performance--I cruise in the FL200-240 range and flight plan 75gph and 260KTAS. She'll do this all day. You can get her higher, but with the stubby wing, it takes forever to get there and you are kinda hanging on the props.
Phase Inspections--This one is tough for me to pin down exactly because we almost always have some other inspection, avionics work, or some other minor thing going on at the same time, but I'd guess we average in the 8-10K range for two phase inspections per year.
What breaks--Not much. Other than recurring inspections, the T-tail inspection hole SB, and routine wear items, we have had very few issues in our almost 9 years of ownership. The 6-year gear inspections can get pricey, because, as I understand it, the F90 only shares main gear structure with the 100 series. The 200/300 gear will not interchange so you are dealing with a very small parts inventory for a very small fleet. Same with the props. We had to replace a few original blades this year because they were at their minimum thickness and it was not a fun conversation with the boss. You can get blades from Raisbeck, but they are more expensive and there is no gross weight increase STC for the F so there isn't much advantage over factory Hartzells. Look for one with recent prop overhauls and preferably new blades.
All told, it is a great airplane for our mission of hauling 3-5 people over 500-700 mile legs. It has the best electrical system of the small KAs, the 200 fuel system which is pretty much foolproof, and good speed for the cost. The boss loves the cabin, and I absolutely love to fly it. I have flown J3s to C-5s and the F is one of my favorites. It is also the sexiest King Air on the ramp in my biased opinion.
Good luck in your search. If you find a good one, you will not be disappointed. I just hope you get to fly it more than I do ours.
03-11-2015, 01:31 PM
#5
Gets Weekends Off
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Jun 2014
Posts: 199
Originally Posted by FoundInTheMind
I operate a 1980 F90 Part 91 and can give you a few data points. We do not fly the airplane enough for me to give you a very good total operating cost, in my opinion. It would be pretty skewed to the high side due to our low usage.
Insurance--we are just a shade under $10K a year for single-pilot, Part 91 ops. Piloting is not my primary role in the company, and I'm told by our broker that hurts us some.
Performance--I cruise in the FL200-240 range and flight plan 75gph and 260KTAS. She'll do this all day. You can get her higher, but with the stubby wing, it takes forever to get there and you are kinda hanging on the props.
Phase Inspections--This one is tough for me to pin down exactly because we almost always have some other inspection, avionics work, or some other minor thing going on at the same time, but I'd guess we average in the 8-10K range for two phase inspections per year.
What breaks--Not much. Other than recurring inspections, the T-tail inspection hole SB, and routine wear items, we have had very few issues in our almost 9 years of ownership. The 6-year gear inspections can get pricey, because, as I understand it, the F90 only shares main gear structure with the 100 series. The 200/300 gear will not interchange so you are dealing with a very small parts inventory for a very small fleet. Same with the props. We had to replace a few original blades this year because they were at their minimum thickness and it was not a fun conversation with the boss. You can get blades from Raisbeck, but they are more expensive and there is no gross weight increase STC for the F so there isn't much advantage over factory Hartzells. Look for one with recent prop overhauls and preferably new blades.
All told, it is a great airplane for our mission of hauling 3-5 people over 500-700 mile legs. It has the best electrical system of the small KAs, the 200 fuel system which is pretty much foolproof, and good speed for the cost. The boss loves the cabin, and I absolutely love to fly it. I have flown J3s to C-5s and the F is one of my favorites. It is also the sexiest King Air on the ramp in my biased opinion.
Good luck in your search. If you find a good one, you will not be disappointed. I just hope you get to fly it more than I do ours.
Insurance--we are just a shade under $10K a year for single-pilot, Part 91 ops. Piloting is not my primary role in the company, and I'm told by our broker that hurts us some.
Performance--I cruise in the FL200-240 range and flight plan 75gph and 260KTAS. She'll do this all day. You can get her higher, but with the stubby wing, it takes forever to get there and you are kinda hanging on the props.
Phase Inspections--This one is tough for me to pin down exactly because we almost always have some other inspection, avionics work, or some other minor thing going on at the same time, but I'd guess we average in the 8-10K range for two phase inspections per year.
What breaks--Not much. Other than recurring inspections, the T-tail inspection hole SB, and routine wear items, we have had very few issues in our almost 9 years of ownership. The 6-year gear inspections can get pricey, because, as I understand it, the F90 only shares main gear structure with the 100 series. The 200/300 gear will not interchange so you are dealing with a very small parts inventory for a very small fleet. Same with the props. We had to replace a few original blades this year because they were at their minimum thickness and it was not a fun conversation with the boss. You can get blades from Raisbeck, but they are more expensive and there is no gross weight increase STC for the F so there isn't much advantage over factory Hartzells. Look for one with recent prop overhauls and preferably new blades.
All told, it is a great airplane for our mission of hauling 3-5 people over 500-700 mile legs. It has the best electrical system of the small KAs, the 200 fuel system which is pretty much foolproof, and good speed for the cost. The boss loves the cabin, and I absolutely love to fly it. I have flown J3s to C-5s and the F is one of my favorites. It is also the sexiest King Air on the ramp in my biased opinion.
Good luck in your search. If you find a good one, you will not be disappointed. I just hope you get to fly it more than I do ours.
Thanks again for all the info!
03-12-2015, 05:13 AM
#6
Line Holder
Joined APC: Jun 2010
Position: King Air E90 Captain
Posts: 40
The prices for maintenance that "FOUNDINTHEMIND" quoted is most likely just for the minimum inspection cost for two phases. You need to understand on our King Air E90 we NEVER get out even close to the minimum inspection cost. We fly around 400 hours per year so we actually have to do a phase every 200 hours. (If you do a single phase at a time it is more expensive per phase than if you did two phases at a time.) I will tell you this I have never taken it in for maintenance and the bill been less that 27k.
03-12-2015, 07:19 AM
#7
New Hire
Joined APC: Jun 2013
Posts: 9
Dufur is absolutely correct and sorry if that wasn't clear. 8-10k is my guess at the cost for two "clean" phase inspections done simultaneously. Add in other stuff that breaks since the last inspections and it will start to ramp up pretty quick. Battery is ~3k, a set of main tires is 2k+...nothing's cheap. Actually our lowest bill for a major trip to the shop was to repair a bird strike to the leading edge. Reskinned a portion, new de-ice boot, and out the door for 12k. Couldn't believe that one, but I bet the insurance company was happy.
I don't know of any STC to put 850shp on an F90. You can get the Blackhawk -135As that they claim will give you 10-15 knots in the flight levels, but they are still rated at 750 shp. The -41/-42As are the 850shp engines on the 200 and are a bigger engine with an additional power turbine. Again, I've never seen a way to put them on an F.
We're probably pushing 900-1000 pph on initial climb, but that falls off pretty rapidly to maybe 600-650 pph by 14-15k. Unless I'm heavy, I still have 2000fpm of climb at 15k, so unless weather or airspace dictates otherwise, I usually punch it on up to the flight levels to save a little gas if the trip is anything longer than about 120nm.
I've never seen the 65-70 gph your friend stated without going to FL260+ or pulling the go-fast levers back. The 600 pounds for 120nm trip at 10k seems crazy high. That would be ~1200pph. Are you sure he retracted the gear and flaps?
I don't know of any STC to put 850shp on an F90. You can get the Blackhawk -135As that they claim will give you 10-15 knots in the flight levels, but they are still rated at 750 shp. The -41/-42As are the 850shp engines on the 200 and are a bigger engine with an additional power turbine. Again, I've never seen a way to put them on an F.
We're probably pushing 900-1000 pph on initial climb, but that falls off pretty rapidly to maybe 600-650 pph by 14-15k. Unless I'm heavy, I still have 2000fpm of climb at 15k, so unless weather or airspace dictates otherwise, I usually punch it on up to the flight levels to save a little gas if the trip is anything longer than about 120nm.
I've never seen the 65-70 gph your friend stated without going to FL260+ or pulling the go-fast levers back. The 600 pounds for 120nm trip at 10k seems crazy high. That would be ~1200pph. Are you sure he retracted the gear and flaps?
03-12-2015, 02:04 PM
#8
Day puke
Joined APC: Feb 2006
Position: Out.
Posts: 3,865
Originally Posted by FoundInTheMind
the F90 only shares main gear structure with the 100 series. The 200/300 gear will not interchange so you are dealing with a very small parts inventory for a very small fleet.
If you have flown one King Air, you have flown ONE King Air.
How Beech managed to build some 2000 absolutely unique KAs under one type is a wonder to me.
Case in point about the doors: none of them is interchangeable even on the same model. So don't let them drop, bounce, or get damaged because if it needs to be replaced, you can't just call up a bone yard and buy one used. The bird goes back to the factory for SEVERAL months while a new door is scratch-built and fitted.
Try explaining that to your boss.
03-12-2015, 05:24 PM
#9
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2009
Posts: 276
You could try this sight also. Not sure if you will get all the info you are looking for.
Aircraft Operating Costs & Performance Comparisons & Airplane Cost Data - What2fly.com
Aircraft Operating Costs & Performance Comparisons & Airplane Cost Data - What2fly.com
03-16-2015, 06:26 PM
#10
Gets Weekends Off
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Jun 2014
Posts: 199
Never out for under 27k? What kind of stuff breaks? I understand beech stuff being exponentially more expensive so thats probably the majority of it. Our last annual on the 414 was right at 30k. However that included prop overhauls at 4500ea. Weve had our cheapest annual at 15k and most expensive at 50k. We seem to constantly be in the shop for random stuff, an oil leak, hsi, manifold pressure guage, tach generator, vac pump... Whatever. My theory behind the question was that we could have something bigger faster and more reliable for not much more money. My spreadsheets show 8-900/ hr operating costs on this thing and that just sounds crazy.
600lbs for 120 miles sounded crazy to me too. Theres just so many facets to this but i really appreciate everyones input!
600lbs for 120 miles sounded crazy to me too. Theres just so many facets to this but i really appreciate everyones input!
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