rickair7777

I'm OK with employers mandating it, but they have to weigh the operational risk of covid vs the operational risk of staffing shortages. Their business, their call. Sometimes "freedom" means OTHER people get to choose who they employ and associate with, it doesn't always mean you get whatever you want.

That includes fed, state, and local governments for THEIR employees. The contractor thing kind of depends on where the contractors work and who they work with. The airline mandate looks like over-reach to me, and OSHA probably as well. I think OSHA is technically legal but probably a bad idea.

Drum

That's good you only get one vote.

I patently disagree with an employer mandating a medical procedure. Which is what this is. Stopped being a "vaccine" when they changed the definition thereof

What you seek is a very slippery slope.

The legislation in works now is going to specifically target employers, of any flavor, so that employee can sue them for ANY mandated medical procedure that causes ill effects.

You're wrong in OSHA. The 5th circuit shows us that in their ruling. Read judge Engelhardts opinion.


I Agree with you in the Fed mandate and airlines. Very thin safefed shows us that as well.

The only thing coming out of this experiment is we see true colors of groups of people and how they truly would go to great lengths to take our freedoms for political expediency.


Gov of new York I believe just ordered elective procedures halted. Go take a look at what is classified as an elective procedure. This is going to cause more damage, again, than the coof is

rickair7777

Again, "Freedom". Sometimes OTHER people have freedoms too, and that includes freedom of association. No US civilian employer can "mandate" anything, medical or otherwise. You're free to not work there.

I also don't think artisanal bakers should be forced to bake cakes celebrating something which goes against their personal beliefs.


I don't "seek" anything. I'm happy that vaccine technology has been able to mitigate this thing (before .gov cut off airline aid) and I'd be perfectly happy if all vaccination was optional. But if private employers want to require vaccination, that's their business.


It's irrelevant until signed into law, bills are a dime a dozen, and often just political posturing that the authors know is doomed to fail.



Could be, but we won't really know until the SCOTUS fat lady sings.

SonicFlyer

That's called "coercion"

rickair7777

No it's other people exercising their freedom to not associate with you. You of all people should understand that libertarian position. If you start a business, I also respect your right to employ people who YOU want to work with.

DeltaboundRedux

"Freedom of Association" has been a dead letter since 1964 (and other 1960's reforms, plus 50 years of court cases ever expanding the individual's right to be included, in everything). Traditionally, FOA implicitly includes the right to exclude. In both the public arena and in private associations, this is now incredibly illegal, with stiff civil and even criminal penalties for those who want to push the envelope.

An excellent book on some of the unintended consequences of this is "The Age of Entitlement" by Christopher Caldwell which argues that many of these reforms created a parallel legal system that de facto has superseded the US Constitution (the CO baking case is an excellent example of this)

Fantastic development, of course, which I wholeheartedly approve of, without reservation. FOA is dead, dead, dead. Huzzah!!

rickair7777

Whether people like FOA or not tends to depend on whether it supports their desired agenda, at that moment. I try be agnostic on that.


Goverment of course needs to serve everyone equally.

SonicFlyer

It's still coercion whether it is legal or not.

And when the government does it, in regards to the vax, it isn't legal.

Red Forman

Not to worry, Fauci only needs two weeks to figure out how bad the new variant is, per the White House…

Nantonaku

He is ringing the alarm bell on this variant so most likely this variant is a nothing. The only constant in this whole mess is Fauci batting 0 for 100 in his initial predictions (or intentional lying "for the good of society"). Maybe they'll get a 5% spike in booster numbers out of this news cycle. They might as well take advantage of the news while they can.