I admired TWA and Pan Am's pay scales in the 60's, 70's and one or two years in the 80's .... Sorta lost interest after that.

 

You must be new to this business. So here's a scenario for you. There is some black swan event for airline X. Their pilots will be taking massive pay cuts and concessions. But... they can go to airline Y, where you work, and slide right in. Where do they go? 1) bottom of the list? Or 2) in front of you?

A national seniority list is a hideous idea unless we get paid by "the union" and that would make it way more susceptible to corruption.

 

BUT...a National Seniority List, along with a National Contract would be the quickest way to get Longevity Based Pay, so...

 

Wow I didn't say let's have a national seniority list. I didn't even imply it. I actually dislike the idea as well. I was simply lamenting the fact that other professions can switch to a different employer and carry their experience with them. If anything I think we should demand extra compensation where we are at specifically because of this handicap. I love how there is always someone on APC who needs additional explanation, today it was James Bond.

 

Many share your thoughts on the 'handicap,' or seniority based market enslavement. And the 'handicap' you reference doesn't even take into account the huge disparity between other positions and portability vs the pilot professional. Scotty was not hampered by our barriers to free market such as a national 'corporate behemoth' union, the RLA, the NMB, etc. Heck, apparently he wasn't even hampered by a 'no compete'!

There are a few ways to work around the handicap for motivated folks. And I believe the evolution of the profession may help to self-correct the above mentioned forces, leading to a more market based pay and benefit picture. I can always hope.

There's the foreign airline route, ugh, and Herndon positions are scarce . Another is to seek a better method of compensation outside of the aviation profession. Yup, there's that(edit-EBastian and company drove me and others in that direction!). Just as young pilots make the decision to forego an aviation career for better pastures elsewhere, we are able to participate in small business, entrepreneurship, etc.

The profession has historically provided this free time, even though the trend from mgt is creating the 'more productive pilot'. The 'golden goose' may be reversed on mgts in the future. If the profession does not support the pilot pool 'golden goose' aspirations, mgts will be indirectly damaging the 'enterprise'. Watch your step, mgt!(IMO)

 

It would actually be the best way for ALPA to increase their membership as well. If they wanted to start a national seniority number system tomorrow with the first newhire, I would think that would be a great thing. No way to figure out how it would work with the existing pilots though. It would be a nightmare.

Never happen though

 

Interesting. As a 2X4 captain, where can you go today and make the kind of coin you are pulling down with the time off etc etc etc?

 

 

It isn't a question of where you can go, it is a question of what you can do for yourself. If you are always looking at options that involve working for money, you will end up on the losing end. Using your 2x4 captain income to acquire assets that work for you is the best route. It takes time, which this job provides. Doing something on your own, rather than relying on the benevolence of Ed will be liberating.

 

I'm convinced one of the reasons that Ed is seeking so many productivity concessions is to stifle our efforts outside of Delta. As a group, our work ethic, motivation and ability to assess risk provides us great opportunity outside of the profession. Many of us make more outside of Delta that we do working for Delta. Productivity concessions that limit our time for income and asset growth outside of Delta makes it easier for Ed and his minions to control the pilot group.