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-   -   TAJV (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/delta/97694-tajv.html)

TAprocon 10-11-2016 06:21 PM

TAJV
 

horseface 10-11-2016 07:57 PM

the most important section of the contract and its reduced to a two page infographic that looks like it was done for a 200 level course. and the author obviously believes he's smarter than most of his professional colleagues.

how bout this in the infographic:
the sharks are going to dismantle us slowly over the next few iterations of negotiations if we don't turn them away now...

Bradshaw24 10-11-2016 08:44 PM


Originally Posted by TAprocon (Post 2221675)

Excellent info. Thanks for posting.

Bucking Bar 10-12-2016 04:37 AM

I think the author has done a good job (excellent job with the graphics) but would respectfully suggest a couple of edits:

Overall - this is not the most important part of the changes in Section 1. The redefinition of "Virgin" is potentially more important. 1 E. 9. is more important. This is getting top billing because it is perceived as a "give" ... lets loop back around to that.

Edits on the Con side
(1) Allows Delta and its partnersslightly more ability to flex in trans-Atlantic flying
(2) A small increase in partner flying, or small decrease in our flying will trigger the block hour protection (Should be a PRO)
(3) Global Block Hour floor, if triggered, could protect Pacific and South America flying (PRO)

Add neutral (or PRO) comments:
(1) Limits are very close to current status quo

Now we come to the part everyone is asking, but nobody seems particularly sure of. The problems calculating this in terms of jobs and money is that we are measuring a ratio - which depends on the performance of Delta and 3 other airlines. So, to make an apples to apples comparison, you must first nail down a time window to measure and admit that the data has already changed since your last measure. Scope is a proactive tool, requiring a lot of strategic thought - where are we going?

Strategically, our partners AF/KLM/AZ are in trouble. They have low- cost competitors in the EU and heavily subsidized ME3 predators eating their global network. They have run to the trans-Atlantic market for safety (taking advantage of the market we have created by restraining capacity, fighting flags of convenience and ME3 carriers). Delta has only limited input on what the trans-Atlantic partners do (and sometimes they have had very open disagreements). The variable Delta can't control is partner flying (within a range that is much looser tan our PWA).

So, if we were to assume a static environment based on the measure period from 2012 to 2014 I could show that going from a 48.5% EASK share to 46.5% EASK share lost XX jobs. However, we were not flying 48.5%, we flew ~47.1%. The difference from 47.1% to 48.5% was published (Contract Awareness Bulletin 15-07) as 60 jobs; 20 Captain, 40 FO. BUT the company did not cut staffing during that period (and obviously the amount of partner flying as they ran to the trans-Atlantic and we ran to South America does not change our staffing. Staffing was maintained by International Block Hours).

A DPA Executive Chairman of Hyperbole & SM Exaggeration might extrapolate (actually they don't do math, but play along) that 1.4 to 2.0 is a 42.85% increase and guess 86 pilot jobs could be affected and 28 of those jobs might be Captain positions. These statements can not be made in isolation without knowing:

(1) Current Delta flying
(2) Current partner flying
(3) The effect of the Block Hour Floor

... and even I am having a hard time with the effect of the Block Hour floor. Let me first state - the block hour floor is an excellent downside protection - so good that I am surprised the company agreed to it. Strategically in a global downturn - Air France KLM is slower than Delta at reducing capacity, so the EASK balance will likely go out of compliance first. Then, Asia - Pacific flying is where I see the most vulnerability followed by South American flying. The Global Widebody +757 BH floor would aid us greatly in the region I believe is the most vulnerable.

By my reasoning (with no inside knowlege) is that Delta is very optimistic about Asia flying and the A350. Good for us.

Here is the chart I've asked ALPA, through our Scope Compliance Chairman to generate (what follows is not vetted, I do not even know where it came from, but it looks right)

https://scontent-atl3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...90&oe=58007DA2

vilcas 10-12-2016 04:57 AM

Great explanation hope the voters get a chance to read it.

Xray678 10-12-2016 08:05 AM

In the name of fairness, I would like to see a graph posted that shows the trans-Atlantic flying levels of our JV partners each year.

Also, if Delta enters into **** poor agreements with its JV partners to where they have no control of the flying levels, why should the Delta pilots pay the price?

Bucking Bar 10-12-2016 08:13 AM


Originally Posted by Xray678 (Post 2221985)
In the name of fairness, I would like to see a graph posted that shows the trans-Atlantic flying levels of our JV partners each year.

Just flip any of our charts upside-down. It is a ratio and their's is a mirror of ours. None the less, those charts are in the Scope Compliance & Analysis reports on our MEC website every quarter.


Originally Posted by Xray678 (Post 2221985)
Also, if Delta enters into **** poor agreements with its JV partners to where they have no control of the flying levels, why should the Delta pilots pay the price?

The TAJV was first initiated by NWA with KLM.

Schwanker 10-12-2016 08:29 AM


Originally Posted by Bucking Bar (Post 2221995)
Just flip any of our charts upside-down. It is a ratio and their's is a mirror of ours. None the less, those charts are in the Scope Compliance & Analysis reports on our MEC website every quarter.



The TAJV was first initiated by NWA with KLM.

Since you want to turn this into north/south, Ken Watts enforced the PWA.

Bucking Bar 10-12-2016 08:34 AM


Originally Posted by Schwanker (Post 2222013)
Since you want to turn this into north/south, Ken Watts enforced the PWA.

Not really. Just a point of historical fact that NWA initiated the first trans-Atlantic JV with KLM.

I like Ken. What does this have to do with him?

Schwanker 10-12-2016 08:43 AM


Originally Posted by Bucking Bar (Post 2222016)
Not really. Just a point of historical fact that NWA initiated the first trans-Atlantic JV with KLM.

I like Ken. What does this have to do with him?

Contract compliance. That's all.


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