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Why do mechanics make less than pilots?
This question has been rolling around in my head for quite some time.
First I'm an A&P, IA, pilot, and have worked as a mechanic for 13 yeas and a commercial pilot for about 6 years. I currently work both positions for a small defense contractor. So I have worked both sides of the fence in GA, defense, and the airlines (haven't flown for an airline yet) for over a decade. I just cant figure out why pilots have so much up potential in there carrier while mechanics typically stall out in the low 6 figures. At the core of the question I have two perplexing thoughts. Supply and demand, I understand there is a Pilot shortage, but from what I have seen there is at least an equal (probably greater) shortage of A&P's in the market. I am 33 and am still the youngest A&P I know, and can't throw a rock without hitting a job offer right now. I love the free markets and supply and demand. I would think that A&P pay would be going up up and away, but it doesn't seam to rely change that much. I see more and more job postings for A&P positions but a relatively stagnant income growth. Cause and effect of a average employee, I'm probably going to step in it on this one but am going to say it anyway. The cause and effect of being an average pilot or mechanic greatly favors the mechanic. When an aircraft takes off it leaves airport A and arrives at airport B. The airplane and time don't care if it is piloted by Bob Hoover or if it is flown by me. The plane still gets there in the same amount of time, burns the same amount of fuel, so basically the outcome is the same regardless. However an AOG aircraft stuck on the ground and the difference between an average mechanic and an exceptional mechanic is frequently drastically different. I have seen aircraft sit downed for extended periods of time not because the mechanic was a bad mechanic, but because he was an average mechanic. The exceptional mechanic comes in and has a better fundamental understanding of troubleshooting and mechanics in general, finds the problem in no time and the plane is back out making money. The hit to a companies bottom line is drastically felt when MX takes longer than it could be accomplished. For this reason I would think there would be more up potential for rely good mechanics to get into that 200K-300K rarefied air that pilots enjoy. In closing I love being an A&P and I love to fly. But I'm considering hanging up my A&P and moving into strictly flying because the pay is so much better. But the question of why still bothers me. |
Kevbo will be along momentarily to spread his vitriol and hatred of the aviation maintenance profession (as he cannot resist). Yours is a view of someone who has thus far a successful maintenance background. His, not so much, so when it arrives, take it with more than a grain of salt.
I also work as an aircraft mechanic and as a pilot and have for many years (closer to 40 now, than 30). The earning potential for a pilot is certainly greater than for a mechanic. This isn't in dispute, and even management positions through Director of Maintenance will not reach pilot earning potential (I've held that position twice). In the cockpit, I wear a white collar (some of the time, depending on the job), while in the hangar I certainly do not. The two jobs are interrelated, but never the less separate descriptions and separate titles. One might ask why the attorney makes more than the legal assistant, though the legal assistant may do considerably more work. Physically the aircraft mechanic does more work, and may work longer hours, but the mechanic doesn't have the same job as the pilot and won't get the same wage. When the flight departs, the pilot has the full responsibility, and the ultimate responsibility for the safe outcome of the flight. It may come down to this: no matter how well the mechanic does his job, or how badly he bungles it, he will go home to sleep in his own bed at the end of the shift, and even the most egregious error on the part of the mechanic will not place him at the scene of the crash. The pilot, however, is the first one to the scene of the crash. An air traffic controller can err, and the mechanic can err, and neither will pay an ultimate price or ever hold ultimate responsibility for the outcome of the flight, but the pilot will. He's not paid for sitting in the airplane while it moves from A to B, but for his judgement in conducting the flight to get it there safely, or return it to the point of origin, or divert it somewhere else. Mechanical objects may fail. We're having copious discussion about this regarding Lionair and Ethiopian right now, as you're aware. It may be a system design, may be improper maintenance, or may simply be a physical failure, short, etc. In the quiet of the hangar, the mechanic or a team of mechanics, may trouble shoot and repair a part, but in the noise and violence of the flight, the pilot will handle it in real time and will either land safely or condemn the crew and passengers, as happened with the Ethiopian 737 Max. In such a case, no matter how great the salary, the pilot will never collect, and that is a very big difference between the pilot and the mechanic. Mechanics disparage pilots, and pilots disparage mechanics; my own assessment is that about 90% of each aren't worth their weight in wet salt. Mechanics don't need pilots; pilots, however, very much do need mechanics and trust their lives to proper maintenance. The reciprocal isn't true, though without the aircraft put in service and flown, the mechanic won't have a job. Efforts have been made to elevate the standing of the profession of mechanic, from uniforms to name changes (eg, Aviation Maintenance Technician, and in some places, Engineer). The perception and the status will remain tied to the level of education and training and certification requirements, as well as the general stereotype. I've worked alongside mechanics fresh from a community college A&P school who quite literally could not remove a 10-32 screw, and I kid not. I once was asked by a young man if he might borrow my die grinder. I offered it, then thought to ask why. He wanted to remove a screw. When I asked how, he said he wanted to cut the panel away (a cargo floor panel in a C-130), so he could get behind the screw and remove it with pliers. Again, I kid not. If that were isolated, I'd be thrilled, but it's not, and it's not relegated to entry level mechanics, either. Not so long ago I was at a foreign location and had a maintenance discrepancy. A contract mechanic was available, who came to the flight deck and said he'd never seen or worked on this type aircraft before. He was not young, not inexperienced, but had zero experience on type. By comparison, I'd spent two months full time training on type, plus line training, just to operate as a pilot. Maintenance doesn't require a type rating (in most places, though it soon may); the A&P graduate is free to work on balloons, helicopters, airplanes, do fabric and wood work, or composites...yet may be quite unqualified to do so. No accounting of currency is made for the mechanic, though minimal legal requirements do exist. Not even a personal logbook is kept in most cases. Further, in a repair station, and even outside, non-certificated mechanics can work alongside certificated mechanics: the non-certificated mechanics may have zero training or experience and work under the supervision of a certificated mechanic or repair station. Imagine if that existed in the world of pilots? "Folks, this is your captain speaking. Today your flight will be conducted by Joe, who is sitting next to me and who I'll be keeping a close eye on. Joe is a great guy who doesn't drink too much and who was kind enough to share a bag of salted peanuts with me at the Diamondback's game last night. Today we'll be cruising at 34,000' more or less, and hope to get to Cincinnatti some time tonight. Please hang on,and have a good flight." Doesn't really inspire confidence. I've been turning wrenches longer than I've been flying, and started in my early teens. I have six rollaways full of tools, and have been a director of maintenance twice, as well as inspector, and have worked in repair stations, line maintenance, heavy maintenance, and all kinds of other capacities doing pneumatic, hydraulic, structural, sheet metal, composite, fabric, wood, electrical, paint, etc, and have worked on radial, light piston, turboprop, and turbojet equipment, for a lot of years. I take maintenance very seriously, and take the mechanics I work with very seriously, as I do the pilots. I say this to emphasize that I don't take them for granted, and I do understand the gravity of the position of a mechanic, which fields a lot of responsibility for a wage that should be considerably higher. I've been stabbed, run over, burned, poisoned, shocked, painted, blinded, lacerated, abraded, beat up, bloody-knuckled and bruised on the job, and I went for years without ever being free of safety-wire cuts and tears, and didn't own a stitch of clothing that wasn't soiled by 120 weight oil and H5606. There have been times my wife wouldn't let me in the house because I smelled of jet fuel too much or was too dirty. I get it. Aviation maintenance is a worthy profession, and I find a very gratifying, and professionally absorbing one. A good sheet metal repair, for example, can be quite complex and time consuming if done properly, and I find very rewarding, too. Just as I find breaking out of a low overcast to find a runway illuminated in front of me to be rewarding, likewise I find troubleshooting a problem, adjusting or repairing a problem, or accomplishing a maintenance task to be quite satisfying. I take a lot of pride and enjoyment from working as an aircraft mechanic, and frankly I'm proud to wear the title. That said, I'm also very well aware that it won't pay as well. A regional pilot won't make what a major airline pilot will make. A mechanic often won't make what a pilot is making in any operation (though I have worked places where I made more in the shop than on the line). There are many jobs in aviation which have similar functions, but have large pay disparities. I've made six figures flying single engine airplanes, that I wouldn't have made doing other kinds of flying in a single engine airplane...but that's the job, that's the pay, and that's the way it is. Typically I'm paid more when the stakes are higher; whether it's a wealthy corporate client, an airplane with a lot of expensive cargo or paying passengers, or a high-stakes mission with considerable penalty for failure. These pay more. Likewise, with more experience come better jobs and better pay, though not in all cases. The wages in aviation maintenance certainly should go up, though I think it will be a very long time before we ever see them where they should be. |
I'm Once again, thanks for the introduction John. Its the low standards and effectively no barrier to entry causing low pay for mechanics. There is zero educational requirements and the system is designed around the absolute lowest form of human labor. My proof lies in the fact that most airline maintenance went to hastily built thirld world facilities and no one noticed. Countries with average IQs of 85 and too poor to produce textiles are able to perform aircraft maintenance. Americans too dumb to finish highschool become A&Ps. There's your level of skill. If you are truly outstanding, what premium is your boss willing to pay. In the case of maintenance workers, not very much! It's much easier for smart guys to either go to school or start a business and move up to a higher socioeconomic class. The last hangar I visited had one older mechanic supervising a bunch of kids and day laborers. They charged $85hr and customers seemed to be okay with what they saw. Most halfway intelligent A&Ps never work in aviation, if they do its not for long.
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Part of it is that our aviation system, through accidents of history, evolved around pilots who were pretty smart and capable. The system now depends on that, although technology and automation has taken the edge off of that just a tiny bit. But airlines still absolutely rely on the pilots to be the Captain of the Ship when it comes to flight ops safety, even if they don't like to admit it.
So people who met the standards to be pilots for the better employers (who also want some people skills, whether airline or corporate) have other options in life. Since you need them to spend a lot of time away from home, you have to pay them to incentivize that. If I could make a lot more in other fields AND be home every night, I'd have trouble justifying aviation to the family. Also pilot unions help increase and stabilize wages. Airline pilots are not as replaceable as mechanics, and pilot unions allow limited or zero outsourcing. During a strike, an airline can't hire and train thousands of airline pilots over night... takes too long, there's not enough pilots out there, and the sim capacity simply doesn't exist. Mx can be outsourced more readily and quickly. |
Mechanics are willing to send pilots, crew and pax off with known anomalies; can't duplicate return to service. Once the mechanic is on the plane his 'disposition' changes. Read Fate is the Hunter.
Mechanics sleep in their bed every night. Pilot is ultimately responsible. The reason why Capt makes the big bucks is so someone can be made liable. |
Pilots and mechanics both make what they can negotiate, especially if they are unionized. Much of the leverage for these negotiations is the principle of supply and demand as you noted. As you may have noticed, the system is set against both pilots and mechanics for getting paid well, and most pilots at major airlines still aren't making the wages (corrected for inflation) that they were making before 9/11. This principle is not isolated to the aviation field. You may have read news articles showing how CEO/executive pay has increased exponentially compared to the average Joe. The CEOs get this money in part because they have become geniuses at figuring out how to make labor work more hours for less money and benefits. Pensions have mostly gone away, employees are paying more of their health care costs, companies restructure under bankruptcy laws and convince workers to take less salary, scope is picked away at during every contract negotiation, etc.
Sent from my moto x4 using Tapatalk |
a mechanic is paid in the same way a pilot is paid. What the union negotiates. This will be between the lowest income someone is willing to do the job for and the upper end is the cost of replacing you. A union drives up the replacement cost but does little for the low cost of entry. So far the entry cost to become a A&P is less then the cost of becoming a pilot.
Its a great field and hopefully the pay will be able to be driven upwards. |
Originally Posted by Airbum
(Post 2802382)
a mechanic is paid in the same way a pilot is paid. What the union negotiates.
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Lots of good observations here.
Cfimechanic- I get where you’re coming from, I also am an a&p ia and a pilot/cfi. I like to do mx and I also like to fly, but it’s been pretty eye opening to realize that the pay in the mx world is going nowhere. I was a mechanic for longer than I was a pilot, but when I switched to full time flying I more than doubled my mx pay in just a couple of years and work nowhere nearly as hard as I was when I was turning wrenches. John said it right- A&P is a blue collar profession, and piloting is a white collar profession (although in some instances a case can be made to the contrary). Also, one colleague of mine who is a&p/pilot once said that mechanics have a pay glass ceiling and I agree with him. In our area, an a&p rated tech can pretty easily start in the $20s (hourly), but you have to be very good to get into the $30s and that’s pretty much where it tops out, unless you’re willing to get into managerial functions or happen to work in a unionized shop. |
Originally Posted by JohnBurke
(Post 2802408)
For those limited few who work under a union, perhaps.
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Ask the question differently? Why should mechanics make the same or more than pilots?
Recall the PATCO guys "If I am controlling five 747s in my airspace then I should be making 5x747 Captain pay." |
Ahhh PATCO. When all pilots became scabs!
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Originally Posted by kevbo
(Post 2802791)
Ahhh PATCO. When all pilots became scabs!
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You don't get paid what you deserve. You get paid what you can negotiate.
Pilots and mechanics are labor. Union now. Joe |
Thanks for all the great responses.
I have trouble with the argument that pilots take on more risk than mechanics and that is why they make more. while yes they should make more I just cant wrap my head around how much more they are making. Statistically roofers have a more dangerous job than both and make less than both. Danger does facilitate higher pay usually because the more dangerous a job is the less people are willing to do that job, driving the cost of labor up. The education argument I also find week. Yes flight school is very expensive, but you can go from 0 - commercial in almost half the time you can get an A&P cert. Also education does not equate to high wages, I have the lowest form of "education" in my family, I am the only one that has no degree. The rest (6 people) have at lest a masters degree and make less than me. Why? Because a PHD in underwater basket weaving isn't in high demand. From what I can tell the two biggest things hitting A&P pay is ability to outsource, and social stereotypes. I understand that outsourcing MX labor A&P pay as well as labor working under the supervision of a mechanic. However the guy in mexico still cant fix the plane stuck at the gate in IAD. I still don't think it accounts for the majority of the gap in pay. The bottom line conclusion I can come to is that social stereotypes drive most of the pay gap between the two professions. People view mechanics as a lower skill set as pilot, which I personally find to not be the case. When I left my last job HR came to me with a very generous offer to get me to stay (low 6 figure), and told me this is a very generous offer at the very top of what the industry offers mechanics. I countered that while I was flattered by the offer that I also am I pilot, and fly. While it is good pay for a mechanic it is on the lower side of average for a pilot. So I voted with my feet. Long story short, I thought being an A&P/pilot would be a great help in my carrier, and in the early days of my carrier it was. It kept me out of the poverty pay range that so many people have to work threw to get to better jobs. However now I am viewing my A&P as the golden par of handcuffs restricting my carrier. Every time I work somewhere they are super excited to have an A&P/pilot, and then because its (in my opinion) harder to get highly skilled mechanics I end up pigeonholed in MX making MX pay while also flying. The response I always get is because that is what mechanics make, never mind we had to higher two people when you left. I guess I'm just frustrated about the invisible pay barrier holding down A&P pay. I will always be extremely proud of being an A&P, and will always be in my mind a mechanic (not technician or engineer) first and a pilot second. But for the sake of my carrier I will pretend to be a pilot first because ultimately foremost I am a money loving capitalist:D P.S. Mechanics don't sleep in there beds every night. They work all Wednesday - Sunday night and get to sleep in there bed all day. |
You bettered yourself and left for greener grass. I did the same thing for probably the same reasons. Unfortunately all the other mechanics do not share this mindset nor do they possess the fortitude to make it happen for themselves. While interesting at first, MX felt like meanial labor when I started working on my bachelors and flying.
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Originally Posted by kevbo
(Post 2803442)
You bettered yourself and left for greener grass. I did the same thing for probably the same reasons. Unfortunately all the other mechanics do not share this mindset nor do they possess the fortitude to make it happen for themselves. While interesting at first, MX felt like meanial labor when I started working on my bachelors and flying.
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Originally Posted by kevbo
(Post 2803495)
Proofread too late. Forgive the bag grammar.
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Originally Posted by cfimechanic
(Post 2803410)
I have trouble with the argument that pilots take on more risk than mechanics and that is why they make more.
On a similar note, our medicals are another risk we take. There are lots of ways for a pilot to lose their medical that would never impact the earning potential of an AMP.
Originally Posted by cfimechanic
(Post 2803410)
The education argument I also find week. Yes flight school is very expensive, but you can go from 0 - commercial in almost half the time you can get an A&P cert.
Originally Posted by cfimechanic
(Post 2803410)
The bottom line conclusion I can come to is that social stereotypes drive most of the pay gap between the two professions. People view mechanics as a lower skill set as pilot, which I personally find to not be the case.
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Originally Posted by cfimechanic
(Post 2803410)
I have trouble with the argument that pilots take on more risk than mechanics and that is why they make more. while yes they should make more I just cant wrap my head around how much more they are making. Statistically roofers have a more dangerous job than both and make less than both. Not a great analogy.
Originally Posted by cfimechanic
(Post 2803410)
The education argument I also find week.
Originally Posted by cfimechanic
(Post 2803410)
The education argument I also find week. Yes flight school is very expensive, but you can go from 0 - commercial in almost half the time you can get an A&P cert.
Two different jobs. An A&P can turn wrenches in a repair station or under the tutelage of a certificated mechanic before the A&P is an A&P. In other words, joe blow (who has never seen a picture of an airplane) walks in the door and a half hour later he's pulling panels on uncle buck's Bonanza. Or a 727. Give that a whirl in the cockpit.
Originally Posted by cfimechanic
(Post 2803410)
Why? Because a PHD in underwater basket weaving isn't in high demand.
Originally Posted by cfimechanic
(Post 2803410)
However now I am viewing my A&P as the golden par of handcuffs restricting my carrier. Every time I work somewhere they are super excited to have an A&P/pilot, and then because its (in my opinion) harder to get highly skilled mechanics I end up pigeonholed in MX making MX pay while also flying. The response I always get is because that is what mechanics make, never mind we had to higher two people when you left. I guess I'm just frustrated about the invisible pay barrier holding down A&P pay.
Originally Posted by cfimechanic
(Post 2803410)
P.S. Mechanics don't sleep in there beds every night. They work all Wednesday - Sunday night and get to sleep in there bed all day.
The pilot, on the other hand, left home and didn't see his bed for 17 days. Or nights. Because he's in Hong Kong. |
Originally Posted by kevbo
(Post 2802791)
Ahhh PATCO. When all pilots became scabs!
Originally Posted by deus ex machina
(Post 2802892)
Would have been nice, but it was an illegal strike, so nice try but no.
Not only that but even if the pilots wanted to, it would be illegal under RLA. Not only that but government employees shouldn't be allowed to strike anyway. |
PATCO was a big domino, it fell and the "man" has been winning ever since. Dubbya hired scary Mary to destroy aircraft maintenance as a viable career in the USA. They were more successful than Regan was, at least ATC jobs remain. MX is a.poor mans job in every conceivable way. I just hate to see some unsuspecting American get conned into making a costly mistake for the benefit of a corporate scumbag. I need to find venues where I can get the word out vocaly since most mechanics can't read.
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Why do mechanics make less than pilots?
Deleted. Already discussed.
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I thought of another thing that might be affecting A&P comparison. When there is a mechanic shortage at a company, the common practice is that everyone else works more hours to pick up the slack. While this is also done with pilots there is more of a limit to how much extra work a pilot can take on. Creating greater demand and in turn raising wages.
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Originally Posted by kevbo
(Post 2803838)
I need to find venues where I can get the word out vocaly since most mechanics can't read.
Originally Posted by kevbo
(Post 2802791)
Ahhh PATCO. When all pilots became scabs!
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This mechanic reads just fine; well enough to understand that one's words often say more about the speaker than the subject.
Case in point. |
Im surprised that so many of you entertained this thread. Pilots really do have an inflated view of their MX, comparing the two is utterly ridiculous. It should asked, "Why do A&Ps make less than any other kind of mechanic" Or almost any other blue collar worker for that matter.
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"Why do A&Ps make less than any other kind of mechanic" Or almost any other blue collar worker for that matter.
I've wondered this many times, I've owned my own shop, and worked at others, and almost without exception the local small engine shop had a higher shop rate, and their mechanics made more. It just never added up to me why a guy changing the oil in a lawn mower would make as much as an A&P. Like others on this forum, I'm a certificated mechanic and commercial pilot, with close to 30 years in the industry. I had a job not too long ago doing maintenance and grounds crewing for an aerial applicator (AKA 'crop duster'), where I was quite vocal about wanting to transition to a pilot position. After 6 years of being there I was making 48,000 year, plus benefits, which was pretty good, and close to the top pay anywhere in the area. The last time I talked to the boss about transitioning to piloting he told me they were more interested in keeping me in the shop, and offered me a substantial pay increase to stay there, his reasoning? It's easy to find pilots, but they couldn't get mechanics. The pilots were making 6 figures for 4 months of work, I was making less than half that for 12. If I have the license, experience, and desire to fly, why shouldn't I? Why would somebody work longer hours for lower pay, to do a job they don't like an much? The obvious answer is pay, if you have your pick of pilots you're paying well in the industry, if you can't find mechanics you're not paying enough. There are other factors to be sure, but pay is the big denominator for getting good people working for you. We were both home every night, the pilots weren't responsible for passengers lives, if anything the ground crew had it harder working sunup to sundown in the heat while the pilots had A/C and frequently had midday breaks. Now, the pilots were certainly more experienced and skilled, and the stakes could be much higher if they screwed up than if one of us screwed up, but it was the lack of willingness to let me try to transition, the desire to keep my in shop regardless of my desire/capabilities that really got to me. If it was an isolated incident I would think perhaps they just didn't trust me as a pilot, but when I left there to pursue flying full time almost every prospective employer I contacted was more interested in my A&P/IA than they were my commercial pilot. And, much like others, I found myself doing more than a little maintenance work. If you think working as a mechanic for pilots wages is bad wait until your employer expects you to A&P for free because you're making the big bucks as a professional pilot! It got bad enough that in the last batch of resumes I sent out I left off the fact that I had my IA, and the first few phone calls started out with 'I see you have your A&P, have you ever considered getting your IA?'. I think it boils down to the industry pays what it has to, it's been established that this is what we get, and there had been enough mechanics willing to work for this pay, so that's where it's stagnated. Someone further up pointed out that there might be a bigger mechanic shortage than pilot shortage however, and that's the truth. There's an even bigger shortage of good A&P's, and I think it's going to get worse before it gets better. |
urp99 I couldn't have said it better.
There is this an extreme shortage of good mechanics especially with there IA. I have gotten the same response from multiple employers you did. We rely need you in the shop, we would put you in the cockpit but pilots are easier to find. But then they pay the pilot more than the mechanic. I to thought it could be a potential character flaw I had that made employers not want to put me in the cockpit. I had to have a lot of talks with a lot of people to come to the conclusion it wasn't me, it's just the way it is (code for it doesn't make sense). It seams to defy the logic of free market capitalism. I am not saying pilots shouldn't make more than mechanics, they should. Its just that the chasm between the two is enormous. |
Socially, you are judged at the lowest common denominator. White collar types see mechanics as someone with dirty clothes and missing teeth. They need you but otherwise want nothing to do with you. Upward mobility is much about the things you simply refuse to do. What do you call an airline captain that cleans toilets? A janitor!
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Originally Posted by kevbo
(Post 2804376)
Socially, you are judged at the lowest common denominator. White collar types see mechanics as someone with dirty clothes and missing teeth. They need you but otherwise want nothing to do with you. Upward mobility is much about the things you simply refuse to do. What do you call an airline captain that cleans toilets? A janitor!
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An A&P would be something to be proud of if it wasn't so easy to get. Worse, it's not even required to work on aircraft! It's silly to discuss. Flying has legitimate barriers to entry. Once these are crossed, a MX background will only make you look bad. Anyone making the change should expounge their past. Treat it like a felony charge that you were lucky enough to beat.
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Originally Posted by kevbo
(Post 2804413)
An A&P would be something to be proud of if it wasn't so easy to get. Worse, it's not even required to work on aircraft! It's silly to discuss. Flying has legitimate barriers to entry. Once these are crossed, a MX background will only make you look bad. Anyone making the change should expounge their past. Treat it like a felony charge that you were lucky enough to beat.
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I don’t get the opinion that getting an A&P is easier than pilot certs. My A&P took 2 years to get, and 2000hrs of required classroom/lab instruction. We even had a time clock we had to punch to track are time. The test took 2.5 days and the only thing I have done that comes close to the test was my CFI check ride.
Now the barrier to entry is a little higher for pilots in that it is very expensive to get. I had to work for 5 years to save up the money to get all my ratings but the check rides were not harder than the A&P test. I will say the A&P written tests are a joke, anyone can pass them. Also I found the IA test to be easy, but I took it after they eliminated the requirement for the oral portion. |
Originally Posted by cfimechanic
(Post 2804489)
I don’t get the opinion that getting an A&P is easier than pilot certs. My A&P took 2 years to get, and 2000hrs of required classroom/lab instruction. We even had a time clock we had to punch to track are time. The test took 2.5 days and the only thing I have done that comes close to the test was my CFI check ride.
Now the barrier to entry is a little higher for pilots in that it is very expensive to get. I had to work for 5 years to save up the money to get all my ratings but the check rides were not harder than the A&P test. I will say the A&P written tests are a joke, anyone can pass them. Also I found the IA test to be easy, but I took it after they eliminated the requirement for the oral portion. |
Chuck Yeager disagrees.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chuck_Yeager I went to one of his Q&A's at Oshkosh and he heavily attributed his success as a pilot to the fact that he was a mechanic first and then became a pilot. |
Might as well attribute his success to being an a**hole, then, because he was one of those first.
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Originally Posted by CardboardCutout
(Post 2804544)
Might as well attribute his success to being an a**hole, then, because he was one of those first.
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Originally Posted by rickair7777
(Post 2803815)
Not only that but unions don't really have to honor other craft's strikes. Where does that stop? If the hotel maids union strikes do I refuse to go on overnight trips so I don't cross their line?
Not only that but even if the pilots wanted to, it would be illegal under RLA. Not only that but government employees shouldn't be allowed to strike anyway. Rick. Seriously. YOU DON'T CROSS THE PICKET LINE. You first work with your union to get the company to change hotels. If unable, YOU change the hotel that YOU are staying at. Hopefully you can get the company to reimburse you, if not you eat the money and consider it well spent. Joe |
Originally Posted by joepilot
(Post 2804994)
Ref the maids strike:
Rick. Seriously. YOU DON'T CROSS THE PICKET LINE. You first work with your union to get the company to change hotels. If unable, YOU change the hotel that YOU are staying at. Hopefully you can get the company to reimburse you, if not you eat the money and consider it well spent. Joe Crossing the line to get to the other side of the road is not "crossing the line". Crossing the line to do your own job is not "crossing the line". You are not protected in either of those cases, most especially under RLA. I agree it's nice to not cross a line if you can help it, and I certainly wouldn't on my own personal time, ie I'd take my business elsewhere. I don't think I'm going to do that on an overnight though, especially at my own significant expense. Curious to hear what others think though. |
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