AA Classes 2017
 

The word is out from the top. Maybe only 3 total classes left in the year for AA. With 30 or 40 pilot in each class, that means that envoy send no more than 60 total pilot by end of year from today. Way less than management predict at beginning of the year. The number they said was 360. Maybe you send 180 all year with this news.

Really bad news for flow. Many here say that the flow never will stop or slow down. It is slowing down big time now. The flow of 6 years for some of those hired last year just got many months added.

Recruiting and P2P's are saying....

Second class in September cancelled. No classes in October. 2 classes in November. No classes in December. Back to "normal" in January

While I agree that the company and its salesmen inflated the number of flows, you are doing the same thing in the opposite direction. Per the union we already flowed 194 through July, and I think we sent another 25 in August, making it 219 for the year.

Growing pains suck.

Is there a provision anywhere preventing a "reverse flow" the next time a 9/11-type of event or economic recession happens and AA has to become leaner again? IMHO anyone making life career/QOL decisions based on something as volatile as programs like these will just set themselves up for utter disappointment :rolleyes:

No, There is no flow back provision.

You do know that this means you can't get hired the old fashioned way either, yes? If AA isn't running new-hire classes, NOBODY becomes a new hire at AA, through flow or any other way. Same as if Delta, United or any other airline stops running classes because of a training backlog. Even the "friends and family program" applicants can't get a class date. Get your panties out of a wad. :rolleyes:

Right, so who told you that I would get disappointed about that anyways? I'm still seeing a pig, no matter what lipstick they try to dress it with :rolleyes:

If American hires 20 one month and 80 after a break we only send 35 at most. Not 50. The rumor I heard is nov will be a big hiring month for them. Too bad they hose the flow and limit us to 25 a month due to operational necessity.

The Sky is Falling!

Still beats the UAL hiring for 2017. They haven't held a new hire class since May and won't be holding another one until Feb 2018 at the earliest.

You heard correct. Nearly 90 for AA in NOV. And yes, we are more than likely to get hosed.

*puts on tin foil hat*
*CONSPIRACY THEORY ALERT*

Maybe AA and Envoy colluded on this to only send 25 total for October and November. Usually 90 would be a number spread out over 2 months. This is a way to keep staffing up at Envoy over the holidays while they get people trained.

Disclaimer: The above post is tongue-in-cheek and is not too be taken too seriously.

Reason
 

From the AA forum:

The 6 weeks hiatus is due to the schoolhouse being jammed. In addition to new hires and CA upgrades, they have a bunch of MD80 (and maybe some others) pilots that need to get ready to fly something else.

Makes sense they waited until after the summer peak to do this.

My guess (no basis other than an educated guess) they may be trying to put a thousand through, in addition to what is normal.

They are going to have to increase the pipeline capacity before the big wave of retirements hits!

Agreed...seems like they've already got to be behind the power curve in terms of gearing up for mandatory and early retirements.

While I don't think AA made their training department plans to screw envoy pilots, I am sure when our management heard their plans this was one of the first things on their mind.

Use contract language to screw the pilot group? Management would never do that....

American Airlines created a training backlog ON PURPOSE just to screw Envoy...more over, to screw ORDinary specifically. They are targeting him personally.

I mean..sure. Having a thousand MD-80 pilots needing to re-train on different equipment on top of the need to hire and train new pilots, upgrade FOs to Captain, all plus the usual recurrent needs...all that COULD be seen as a normal and understandable reason for a training department bursting at the seams.

OR, we could go with the first and more likely scenario. This is all a ploy to personally screw with Envoy pilots. Thanks for this wonderful thread. It's added so much to our knowledge. Since we are on topic, how much has United and Delta been hiring? And if AA slows down hiring, is it just for flow throughs or would that include street hires as well?

Final question: can we assume that AA won't increase their training capacity at any time ever? The current amount of instructors they have is the amount they will always have? We can safely say they won't hire any new instructors ever, right? Cool...that's what I was thinking as well.

Thanks fake rondon!

We aren't discussing backlog. We are discussing if flow was a factor is when AA schedule the dates of their new hire classes this year. I for one think It could have played a role in it. (I don't know and wouldn't bet either way. To say it couldn't happen would be ignorant.) In the past we flowed during the furloughed guys were coming back. Envoy and AAG knew they needed to do it so they could continue to sell the flow.

If they stack a massive number of new hires in one month and meter the flow then yes I do think collusion could have happened. Again I don't know and I really could care less. I got the upgrade class to loo forward to. Bring on DNR, long term, and all that good stuff.

I'm confused. Someone posted a conspiracy idea while admitting they didn't actually believe it and I responded that I also didn't really believe it. Is your problem one of reading comprehension, or are you just desperate to find some way to troll me, even when it doesn't make sense?

I think he was being sarcastic but I'm not sure...

There's so many trolls these days you forget who is trolling who.


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I troll the trolls...not you. Lol..sometimes my trolling does a loop and I get caught in my own crossfire! Otherwise, I'm just a sarcastic s.o.b.

Alright, it's cool. Like I said, I was just confused. Carry on.

So if envoy was planning on sending 25 a month and American came out of left field with this 90 a month then nothing perhaps envoy would just allow 45 guys to flow in one month. Why not? They obviously planned on 360 to flow this year and planned our hiring according to their expectations. I expect envoy to do the right thing and allow 45 of our guys to flow

^^^ I sincerely can't tell if you're joking.

LOLZ... filler


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Hahaha...you're funny

The real question is this, are our elected reps pulling fingernails trying to make this happen or are they rolling over and showing their belly. If they're bending over now then you can all expect an unexpected slow down twice a year once in the summer and once in the holidays. What's stopping them.

If you contacted them they could give you an answer.

I spoke with my rep, and he said they're working on it. Part of the union's stance (aside from the fact that flowing more people would keep to keep projections on target) is the optics of flowing more than the metered minimum. It's good for recruiting and would also make mgmt look like they throw us a bone every once in awhile. It would be a win-win in a situation we don't have any control over (AA stopping classes).

He didn't say if the company is receptive to the idea or not, but the union is trying.

Hey Dawg...did you ask your rep about anything else? Like this very cryptic, upcoming Reserve overhaul? I would ask my own reps but I don't know who they are. I don't think we even have a CA rep in DFW currently.

He said we'd see something about RSV in the next 2-3 weeks but couldn't give details. It will be voted on by the pilot group after road shows. Sorry I don't have anything else.

Somehow I get the picture in my head of Oliver Twist holding out his empty bowl and asking for more. Of course, we know how well that request went....

Cool beans...thanks for the info.

The union has been trying to push them not to meter for over a year now, to no avail. I'm certainly not going to hold my breath or say crazy things like I expect the company to do the right thing. I would love to be proven wrong and will happily admit it if I am, but to me there is almost no chance they will give up pilots they don't have to give up right before the holidays. Christmas to them is when you force contract votes with liquidation threats, not when you give gifts. And if we are getting enough new hires and getting flights out on time, why would they need to throw us a bone? Bones cost money.

Where's cr700 or dacuj on this?

Well dacuj is banned but would just say we'll flow 500 next year to make up for it, and cr700 would tell us we are a bunch of whiners.

They metered flow in early 2016 when we had over 100 reserves in each of a few different statuses (they said the metering was due to future theoretical staffing levels). If they metered then, it seems like they'll always meter.

They metered the flow when we offered zero time lines.

That's right! I forgot about that.

From an AA thread:

"SEP 5 (38 Pilots)
NOV 7 (44 Pilots)
NOV 28 (44 Pilots)

No October or December classes."

That would likely mean we flow 19 in Sept, 25 in Nov, 44 total remaining for the year. I believe that would make the 2017 total 263.