Flying is seasonal, employment at envoy isn't. We are way overstaffed for Jan February March, but not so much for the summer. Last summer there were NO OFE reserves for about a month. None, not one. They plan to stretch our staffing thin again this summer. Reserve goes in cycles as to how many people are on it. The best reserve system is the one your on the least

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When does Envoy's current contract expire?
 

Fear mongering? I was there man. If it is exactly the same vendor four years ago, the same vendor used for FAs now, it is crap. Not to even mention the IT issues it has too. I had to use a specific version of a certain web browser just to get it to work!!! (On a windows system WTF?). The only person who benefits from PBS is the company. The PBS workgroup even did roadshows and I was shocked that they would even chose such awful software. It performed like it was wrote in a computer science class at a community college.

Now I would be willing to entertain a different vendor (at least more user friendly) while the pilots control the majority of the pairings, then I would love to sing a different tune.

Until then I will be a big fat NO!


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Assuming we would end up with one of the good versions of PBS agreements is unrealistic. Also comparing mainline QoL to ours is a joke, right? You really think the reason mainline DAL, UAL, and AA all have better QoL than envoy is because of their PBS??? Come on.

Yes there are hundreds of versions, but we already have an idea of what it would be like for us......http://eagle.alpa.org/LinkClick.aspx...%3d&tabid=6677 Pilots had no control over the pairings. If you don't think that old agreement would be a starting point I think maybe you don't realize who we are dealing with here. They do not negotiate in good faith. And this is zero sum: anything about our scheduling that is saving the company money is costing us.

DTS and transition conflict pay would be lost with PBS. Currently anyone with 3 weeks vacation can turn it into 6 or 7 weeks off. And anyone with a transition conflict can get paid twice for a day or two of work. Giving these up are concessions.

I couldn’t agree more.

Mathematically Equal?
 

Begging forgiveness for my ignorance, but isn’t this mathematically not quite correct?

The flights and times are what they are. The company pays for those. Thus, the company doesn’t gain with PBS from a pay for hours flown perspective.

Pilots who “use” the system, albeit following the contract, are the ones who would lose. As you describe ... and by reduced overtime opportunities and likely critical coverage opportunities. There would also be fewer opportunities to “sit reserve” and then grab overtime on their days off.

However, other pilots, especially junior seniority pilots, would gain because they would get lines, have less reserve, and commute for no reason less often. Aren’t those all things that are complained out a LOT here on this forum?

So, it seems that PBS would “spread the wealth” across the flock of pilots whilst reducing overtime and other costs for the company.

Am I missing something?

PS Not that one of couldn’t choose to sit reserve ... just that it would be much more difficult, less likely, to do that AND get some overtime.

This makes all lot of sense. I didn't know the previously proposed system was so bad.

This is 100% correct.

For those of us who were actually here when we were seriously working on rolling out PBS can speak to how terrible PBS would be for this pilot group. We were trained on the software, we had mock parallel bids using current line bidding and PBS bidding, and we had a clear view of what PBS would look like once it launched here at Enovy. It was terrible. And as others have mentioned, losing DTS would be a HUGE loss, especially now that we only get 14 days of vacation a year until year 8 pay. No conflict pay, huge reduction in OT. Just not good. But I guess I'm just fear mongering. I'm glad you new guys have it all figured out.

This.

They'll do anything to get off reserve for what 4 months now?! Boohoo. That would have been a dream for many guys here who spent 3.5+ years at the bottom on reserve. Thankfully they can't vote on probation.