You think every OFC will be displaced to same base/equipment?

There was only 1 OFC who "had" to take the CRJ in the last class. The other guy chose it. You think he too will suddenly decide he wants DFW?
Our class had a few disappointed guys because no 145 were offered. They wanted LGA base and now have to commute to fly the 175. They can't wait to upgrade to the 145.

Assuming the displacement will be split in 2, that's what, a month of movement for you? No, I don't think it's a big deal.

I hope things turn out well for you. Given the seat you’re in, any inconvenience is likely to be minor and fleeting. However, in 145 hell even 2-3 senior pilots coming into the list could be enough to keep otherwise-lineholding FOs on reserve for a couple more months.

I think they are referencing the CRJ FO's movement, which to be honest has mostly senior people on it, therefore a vast majority will most likely be upgrading as opposed to moving to the right seat in something else. Sure there will be some that do that, however your seniority is also improving as 145 pilots above you upgrade, flow or retire. Lastly, if those FO's do go directly to another FO seat, my hunch is they will most likely stay in ORD, since that is where most of them have been for years.

I understand it's hell for you, we get it, but it will improve. With all the E75's coming, I see people flocking to that fleet as well, so movement should improve on the 145 side of things.

I notice many people suggesting that the pace of movement and fleet growth on the 175 helps those of us marooned on legacy fleet FO island, but how is that possible as long as there are plenty of CA slots to go around and we’re pinned by a permanent FO seat lock? With no bidding around, the FO staff in each fleet face experiences that are so different as to defy explanation without talking about them like different airlines.

Because as vacancies open on the 175 FO’s above you will try and upgrade to it, thus moving you up the list.

Can I ask, which base are you in and are you there by choice?

The barrier to upgrading is not CA jobs, it’s 121 hours. Who is getting the 121 hours? If it ever becomes CA jobs, how does not having the hours before that reality sets in help me? This is simple math and applicable to every base.

Because as you move up the list, you will fly more. It’s pretty simple really. Movement above you on any fleet will lead you to more flying hours.

It’s pretty typical to get about 250-300 hours your first year here and then ratchet up from that point.

Base does matter. If you are choosing to work in a high seniority base then your time off reserve will take longer.

You don't get it man. Senior pilots in same seat have to leave to move you up the list. Senior pilots can't leave because they flew less year one and don't have the minimum hours (currently the only barrier to upgrading).

I am not sure how to explain this any better.

Are there any fixes in the works for the reserve times? That’s the only thing holding me back from Envoy. Losing 700 hours in the first year by going to Envoy is tough

Are you arguing just to argue now? How do you figure it has to be the same seat? If you are an LGA based FO and 10 OCL flow out, that means you could have 10 LGA FO's now ready to upgrade bid over to it. Movement above means movement below. Sure movement on your fleet is quicker, but hell any movement is good.

Your point still doesn't add anything, your first year or so here will be slow, somewhere around 300 hours but after that it picks up. You still never answered my question, what base are you at and did you choose that base? If you don't want to say the location, that's fair, but at least tell me that you are choosing to stay there or not. If you are choosing to stay in DFW, well that is your problem, I understand it if you live there, but you cant complain about hours when you are choosing to live and work in the most senior base. If you are in LGA or ORD, hang in there it will improve. When was your DOH?

I know you say 145 is the hell fleet, but is also our largest and with the most bases, giving you the most choice. I know people on every fleet and they all have nearly the same first year or so in terms of hours, which is what I am talking about here, not quality of lines and all of that.

As for the upgrade comment, yes, it takes about two years right now to upgrade. 300 or so your first, about 700 your second.

CA vacancies aren’t determining the pace of upgrades. Hours alone are determining whether or not a pilot upgrades on a given vacancy. How this has escaped you is a mystery to me.

The CRJ is the hell fleet, the 145 experience is similar for the first year though.

Hi Everyone

I have scheduled an interview with Envoy for the following week. Has anyone gone through it recently? Would like to know what to expect. I am very interested. Thanks!

Lol. Listen, if you are last on the list and people upgrade, you move up the list and get more hours. I understand you still need the 950 but my point is that as people upgrade or flow above you, better opportunities open for you to get more hours. How this escapes you is a mystery to me. You fail to realize that as people upgrade the qol for those below them improves, which includes hours.

People upgrading out of FO seats on other fleets doesn’t affect me at all. I can see you haven’t thought much about this, but are stubborn enough to go back and forth endlessly regardless, so this will be my last attempt to explain things to you.

I have a friend interviewing with Envoy shortly, do you know if current 121 ( with another regional) have to do the tech portion, or is just HR. Someone had mentioned to be last year it was HR only, has that changed. Thanks in advance.

Tech and HR for everybody.

Thanks for reply. Also what is the quality of life there. Can you drop trips/RSV, fly little or fly a lot? My buddy is at a regional that is so short staffed he can't even get a day off to attend a family issue once in a blue moon.

Thanks

If you are on reserve as an FO probably won’t fly much. But don’t expect to ever drop a day. Sometimes you can drop a turn at the end of a sequence, but most of the time any days or legs you ask to drop will be denied.

This, as almost everything here, depends on your base and fleet. I've dropped a few RSV days no problems.
Also, junior FOs in my seat fly a decent amount, 40-50 a month, the more senior guys don't even bother to commute in.

I would caution the suggestion above of not commuting in for RAP (ie not being available within the required 2 or 3 hour callout). Pilots have been terminated in the past when caught doing this for time card fraud.

Filler.. posted above

It was definitely not a suggestion. Not sure how you understood it that way.
Just an observation.

Standing by for an HI6 reminder prior to noon.

I’m sure RN will have something to say. What’s the difference between sitting RAP in MKE and driving to ORD or choosing to sit RAP in MSN and flying in? If you watch the list, start making your way to the base when it gets closer to you, tell scheduling you’ll be out of pocket for thirty minutes but accept and confirm any assignments sent your way, then who cares? These guys are trying to crucify everyone that they can.

There’s no difference so long as you can make your designated callout period.

Do both fleets have a NYC base? If a newhire FO is not awarded NYC initially, is it pretty easy to bid for it later? Thanks.

Only 145 in NYC

Probably can get NY in three to six months. There have been bids every three months for the last few years. It might be possible to have it awarded while in training and not spend time in another base (ORD), but NY is small and shrunk a bit. Part of it just depends on where your hire date falls in the bid cycle.

That being said, depending what your timeline is, there are probably better options than Envoy if you want NY.

What would the better options be? Republic and Endeavor would be great options except they make you wait forever for a class, and I’m thinking upgrades would take longer than at Envoy. Expressjet maybe? Commutair? Any insight is appreciated.

That’s why I said depends on your timeline. If you can wait. The reason they are filled and Envoy isn’t should tell you something.

Do you have a degree?

If so, I'd go to C5, fly my ass off out of EWR and CPP to United in 2 years.

It's 1000 hours command, or 3000 company time minimum. All to qualify for a program predicated on passing the Hogan and an HR interview, only to sit in a pool with zero transparency. Is it better than playing the street hire game? Sure, but it also isn't a magical fast pass to Rhapsody in Blue either.

You could even make the argument that United might be interested in poaching their competition's future hiring pool rather than take any more than necessary from any CPP program.

Huge percentage of UA new hire classes are CPP hires now. Easily as many as AA flows. They can't hire everyone at once, but it seems like a good chance to build time quick (won't get that at envoy on the legacy fleets) Hold NYC (maybe not at envoy) and get a quicker trip to a major (won't get quick at envoy).