Is AA just a glorified Envoy?
 

I know that almost anything is better than Envoy. That’s a given. The question is.... is Big Daddy Doug turning AA into a place we want to spend our careers at? The way things are going with upper management at AA doesn’t look much brighter than Envoy. Everybody wants to go to a legacy mainline, but when I ride the jumpseat it’s sounds like Envoy management is at AA.

What part of Envoy do you think Envoy has control over? AA isn't a big Envoy. Envoy is a little AA.

Wildcat basically answered your question. The market does show that AA’s strategy is not working but I don’t think Envoy mgmt’s seething contempt for it’s mostly well-meaning line employees is really part of that. It has more to do with charging Delta prices for Spirit service with a large helping of exposure to bitter, angry customer facing employees you can’t get in such a concentration at any other airline.

This pretty much sums it up really. While Delta does things to improve passenger comfort, we cram more seats in the back with the excuse that we "will give customers more options" bull****. If people want rock bottom prices with no frills and al la carte pricing that's what the LCC's are for, not a mainline carrier. We should be prioritizing experience first, price second and only try to compete with the legacy carriers in that respect.

I dont think Doug will be around too much longer if things continue down this road. I mean they can't even use stock value as a reason to keep him anymore.

If we can get rid of Doug, maybe they won’t have an excuse to keep Mesa on board either.

As much as things can improve at AA, the realistic fact is that the overall employment experience at AA is eminently better than at Envoy.

I'm sure I could tolerate a lot more BS if I'm getting paid 4x as much, so there's that...

This. This 100%

hahahahah true.....sigh

I wonder if AAG is aware that the flow is going to bring in a bunch of bitter regional folks that are hell bent at getting their due and proper after being beat up for the previous 7-9 years.

There is alot of side effect to this regional game. FUPM won't just be a regional cry, it'll be a mainline way of life from now till infinity. MAAGA

That, and that there's nowhere near as much BS to put up with.

It’s nothing new unfortunately. We were flowing guys at 20+ years then 18, 16, etc all the way down to where we are now due to the lost decade, great recession, and subsequent bankruptcy. They were just as beat up and bitter (if not more) as the current group of PP going now.

Imagine that. Using your 175/190 type rating that you already hold to get paid 4-5 times as much. It always surprises me that people don’t talk about this fact more.

That is a great point, and fortunately that way of thinking is starting to show up more and more across the industry. When I was a -175 FO, I can remember landing in IAH from ORD, and parking right next to a -190 from PHL, and just shaking my head at the contradiction. It's funny too, because there are still a lot of people that say our captains need more experience before they can fly the same plane again as an FO. Someone earlier said stop calling us regional pilots, but rather call us 'B scale' pilots.

Naw. They'll find a legalistic gizmo to let them do away with flow. It has happened elsewhere.

If that's what you know, you must be lucky to be young and have had an easy life. If all goes well in this industry, hope that continues for you:)

7-9 whole years....wow.

It's a lifetime for an average millennial.

Sadly, it seems that the concept of “equal pay for equal work” only applies to your plumbing. God bless America...