Mec and mgt, like watching a married couple, and then the woman mgt says your cut off, the mec men respond I did not mean that, what can I do to make it up to you. Period.

Thanks Brother,
I miss all of you guys too. I don’t miss the unethical, dishonest, shenanigans from management. It’s been nice taking my positive space ticket to/from work on different airlines and seeing so many of our guys in the mainline cockpits. Just rode with a former NY pilot taking me home on Delta not too long ago.
You’ll have a hard time getting real fighters in the union at Envoy. The precedent has already been set that they can repeatedly target, repeatedly harass and eventually fire people who give them grief. My advice, get in, get your hours and get out. That AA flow should be a last resort. It’s rapidly becoming a giant LCC.

It was a distinct honor to have been elected by you all to represent you, to keep the company in check, and to fight for what was right.
The Envoy pilot group was and remains one of the most professional groups of aviators and friends I’ve ever had the pleasure of knowing.

I still keep tabs, with way more contacts inside those buildings than Ric Wilson or Pedro could even imagine.

Personally, when the MEC chairman leaves, I think the MEC should consider hiring a professional union leader rather than a pilot who when push comes to shove works for the company at their leisure; somebody they can’t threaten, intimidate or fire repeatedly.

I have stated numerous times that we need someone that is in charge who is outside of Envoy employment. The only reason why we dont it seems is that the MEC is like any other political power, they dont want to give up control. Not to mention, MEC chair looks good when ALPA national calls.

In fact, it is blatantly absurd that we have negotiating teams that can be intimidated by the company. How it has gone on this long is strange to me, although, even mentioning changing lawyers at the MEC will get you drawn and quartered so I guess that's the way it goes.

One prominent poster here is now high up in the MEC, perhaps they can chime in on their individual thoughts.

I have only been here for a little bit but what was just posted above seems to be the root cause of a lot of problems. Get someone external who cannot be threatened by management and who has not to worry about his own flow or getting fired.

Like said before, kind of staggering that this has been going on for so long.

For reference; this company has fired union LEC/MEC representatives 12 times since 2000 some several times. One was fired seven different times. Always got their jobs back eventually, except for two. The other ones have already flowed.

Fflllooooowwwwww.......
 

Is it to late in the game to ask for the pilot group to vote?


Serious question! I think this requires a vote. Just my opinion.

If company can pull away, why can’t we? Give them a dose of their own medicine.

Fflllooooowwwwww.......
 

This is key to leverage. Current ALPA CHAIRMAN style.



5 KEY MEN would not survive in today’s environment. How many losses can our pilot group take? Who would even try. I’m very nervous for the future of this pilot group and it’s future union leadership members (overall).

Promises to start a better relationship with your pilot group is not the responsibility of the pilot group. Anyone who has studied management knows “culture” starts from the top, not the bottom.

June 1st is slap in the face vs. PSA. There goes our the 1% Jan 2020 advantage. Flow should never be leverage in negotiations, it’s in the company’s best interest to flow faster. They save AAG millions by having a younger pilot group.

Any truth they’re going to start interviewing for the “flow”?

No. Where did you hear that from?

Yeah that’s total bull*******


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Heard from recruiters at AA that passing the Organizational Fit Assessment and overall review before flow may be mandatory very soon. Too many "bad eggs" are flowing from all 3 of the WOs.

That’s funny, haven’t heard that at all from AA recruiters [emoji3166]


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Ah. Recruiters. The universal source of 100% verified facts.

No, the 100% universal source is the flight attendant who is friends with the second cousin of a check airman who heard directly from RW


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Yeah I find it hard to believe but that’s the rumor. Didnt know if anyway else had any info on that.

If anything it should be mandatory for newhires at Envoy. I came here for the no questions asked flow and so did a lot of people. As long as you keep your nose clean while at Envoy..

Or the pilot wife facebook page.

At least we finally have SOMETHING to talk about here. It has been WAY too quiet. 🤣🛩

I heard we are losing our E175's. Compass is opening bases in ORD and DFW and are taking the jets. We are bringing back all the 135's that are sitting in the desert. A CPZ recruiter told me that.
Any truth to this rumor?

I'm ready for the LAX E135 flying

I heard from an APA guy who is also a recruiter for AA said we are getting a PHX base operating the MRJ Spacejet and the 737 after we buy MESA and take their aircraft.


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Jfk - LAX dhd’s are gonna be mint.

I’m buddies with an AA recruiter. They haven’t heard this rumor.

Some buddy you have if they won’t get your app pulled outside of the flow.

How about a new interactive seniorty list?
(Yes I've heard the whole AA flow story)

They updated it just before the last bid and then again about a month later. Hopefully they will do so again soon since we should have another bid out in a week and a half or so. I’m surprised we haven’t had a fifty people asking all of those associated questions. Like I said, it has been very quiet. No fun to start rumors unless people are asking ridiculous questions or questions that they could answer if they just read the previous few posts.

What's the point? They can fire them without reason. People seem to forget that even if you flow, you're on probation your first year at AA.

The point would be to avoid wasting a training slot.

Burnnnnnnnnnnnn [emoji91]


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They'd waste a few thousand spots at the WO's. I'd be making a bee-line to frontier, spirit or JetBlue if this happens.

If it turns into an interview, I'll wait for my AA interview somewhere that pays well and treats me humanely.

I’m guessing you’d still complain :-)

If only it worked that way...

I’m a CPZ pilot and that is true! JUST
KIDDING! That’s all of us at CPZ’s dream though to get more flying.

Unfortunately it does, having witnessed it about 4-5 times.

Nothing against those that managed to get in, I would have leveraged every connection also.

Everyone with more than 9-12 months to flow should be trying to get out to other majors or LCCs

Interesting quote from someone that appears to have been hired circa 2017. Do you personally have one foot out the door, or is are you just floating this for self gain?

I hope they do interview for the flow. I’d pass the interview, don’t want to fly with someone who wouldn’t, and it would force Envoy to match or nearly match non-WO compensation/QOL to attract more suckers.

Yea I'm an early 2017 hire. Sure, my "years until flow" projection on the interactive seniority list is lower than most, but even I don't drink that kool-aid. I have apps out where it matters to me and keep them updated regularly. Trying to do my best to network my way out before the flow approaches. It's just friendly, unsolicited advice that I think that's in everyone's best interest, both above and below me on the seniority list to be looking for another way up and out. Flow isn't a done deal for anyone anymore and it's almost worthless for a lot of people here. If those that can leave for better things do, it helps those that can't.

Envoy isn't somewhere that a smart person wants to risk getting stuck. Some folks might leave for Spirit up until a year prior to flow or even later. Delta? I know there are people that would leave inside the first year at AA.

Well... one thing you can say about the flow. At least we are getting hired at AA.

Go look at the Endeavor forum. Hats off, lanyards on.

Sucks to work at a place for 4-5 years, get a double no-go, and then find out kids out of college are getting hired well before you.

And I could imagine it's not much better on the United CPP side.

You hope so at least. It's really nothing more than that at this point.

I agree, the DGI and United CPP are both basically garbage but what good is an 8 or 9 year flow? It's definitely not "hired at AA".

It's still the best career advancement program out there.