BURRRR - It's getting cold out there!
 

Envoy Fellas,

ORD/LGA can get cold - tips for staying warm AND out of the CPO?

The new MH overcoat stinks. Baggy, uncomfortable, heavy, sucks to tote around. If we hate it what are our options?

Anyone tryout the new A Cut Above sweaters?

I’ve always been able to get by with the leather jacket and a sweater under it if needed.

A scarf and some gloves doesn’t hurt.

:-)

Does nooone believe in tailors anymore?
They have guys and girls out here that will turn a Van Hussen Aviator xxxl parachute into a Cut Above quality blouse for $5-10 bucks.

The Cali sweater from A Cut Above is the way to go.

Life changing trick.

100% wool base layers (medium weight) and socks. Big investment but life savers. They keep you warm and you wont get too hot in the cockpit. They regulate body temps extremly well. I use smart wool base layers and good high quality socks. Also, wool can be worn for extended periods (4 days) without having to be washed.

I just saw on the 'A Cut Above' website this sweater/jacket.

https://acutaboveuniforms.com/collec...sweater-jacket

It looks similar to the Twin Hill sweater we used to have. Just hope the zipper lasts longer, as this is not a cheap garment. I might buy one and report back.

Looks nice, but did you see the estimated shipping date? December, 10th.

Yeah that’s a ways away.

There once was a filthy rumor that if you wore a sweater you didn’t have to wear the blazer. I actually looked in FM1 and didn’t see that. Anyone have any truth data on that?

Granted it says I should be wearing the twin hill uniform (sigh).

Perrone leather jacket for the win. Warm and comfy. Pop the collar for chicago walk arounds.

I’ve heard that as well and have seen people only wearing the sweater. But I haven’t seen in writing where it’s allowed.

Be real. No one gets written up for their uniform. I had an FO last week that didn’t even wear a belt. When our planes look like they’ve been thru a hail storm how can they expect us to live up to a Grade A standard. Wear what you want.

That was something you could do with the optional purchase Twin Hill zip sweater. It was designed to be worn that way (per the Twin Hill collection look book) and was allowed as such at mainline. Down here it existed in a gray area. Since we still don't have a clear uniform standard, you'll see it on those who bought it when it was available.

If folks look at the M&H website, you will find demo uniform pictures that suggest that their pullover and cardigan options are intended to be worn under the blazer as a layering piece. This effectively takes us back to the pre-Twin Hill sweater option as you see in the FM-1. For those coming from the Army, you will find that the GI cardigan is a near match for the M&H, albeit in a higher quality English wool.

If folks want to walk around the concourse in a commando sweater, I hear that SkyBest is hiring with longevity.

[QUOTE=uavking;2904998]That was something you could do with the optional purchase Twin Hill zip sweater. It was designed to be worn that way (per the Twin Hill collection look book) and was allowed as such at mainline. Down here it existed in a gray area. Since we still don't have a clear uniform standard, you'll see it on those who bought it when it was available.

Interesting! The company language on uniforms is ... lacking. Especially with the forced switch to a new supplier that provides so little options.

Did mainline/APA have any real say in this uniform? What is their policy in sweaters and non MH overcoats/trench,pea coats?

As long as we look professional does anyone really care?

There are pages dedicated to the Twin Hill/M&H uniform debacle. It can be assumed, however, that AAG intent is to present a consistent brand and the uniform is part of that.

That said, is this the Army and is your chief pilot going to appear out of nowhere like a First Sergeant and hem you up? Probably not.

Is the soft shell jacket sold at Crew Outfitters acceptable? I’ve seen a couple folks with it. It looks similar to the one from A Cut Above on page 1

M&H is an emergency uniform hammered through to disarm professional plaintiffs who got hired as mainline flight attendants. Of course it’s trash.

now they get Land’s End and we’re stuck with it.

I still have my old twin hill pants with a cut above shirts and still on occasion use the zip up sweater. I have never been approached about my uniform and if the day comes that i am, I will switch. I mean come on, take one look at the 140's coming out of the desert and tell me that they don't look like something straight out of a scrap heap. I would think passengers would feel much more uneasy about that then me using a zip up sweater.

Until then, I see no reason to wear those uncomfortable coats. In response to the mainline, I have seen, albeit rarely, an AA captain using the sweater.

This ^^^^^^ Wear what you want. Look professional and keep it clean. Who cares if its an approved piece or not. Comfort above all else. Y'all overthink it.

And don’t be the guy who wears the blazer over the sweater.

Layering is key to staying warm, and that is precisely why thin sweaters work so well under suiting. With a sweater, blazer, gloves, and a watch cap you are prepared for most anything short of hard rain or Fargo cold during a winter walk around if you don’t want to carry the town coat. Now the jumper/pullover vs cardigan debate is eternal, and a matter of personal choice, but there is a reason why sweaters make an appearance in business suiting during the winter. Heck, ask a vet what he thought of his GI sweater or field jacket liner under a BDU top during the winter and odds are he’ll say that it was the best thing going.

Don’t be the guy who wears a uniform item as it was intended, eh? Brilliant. See: https://mandhuniforms.com/store/asse...UniLSFBK.4.jpg

https://mandhuniforms.com/store/asse.../UniCFBK.4.jpg

The Twin Hill sweater has kind of funky collar. It is designed to be a collar, but doesn’t lay down very well. I might have worn it one sequence under the blazer, but whether the collar is down or not, it just doesn’t work well. I never had any problems with the zipper on mine.

The uniform debate will be eternal and that’s not changing. Everyone has their opinions some of them are rooted in policy, preference, others in common sense or practicality and yet some still are rooted in the desire to be cool or different. Some even go the extra mile to make sure they can NEVER be identified as a pilot.

It was the same at express. Wear what you want to wear, look professional, don’t worry about what anyone else thinks. guess what? In the winter.... I sometime BRING/WEAR the hat!! OMG THE HUMANITY. WHAT A TOOOOOLLLLLLL BAGGGGGG


:-)

I'm personally a fan of the plain black North Face jacket. Looks like it could be part of the uniform, still warm

In an ideal world we would have a soft shell as a uniform option (see Alaska with their Transition Jacket or Southwest with their Karbon Aviator jacket). It would be lightweight/packable, water/wind resistant, and usable with civvies. However, that makes way too much sense, and that’s exactly why you’ll never see it here.

If anyone still has the twin hill sweater in Large that you aren’t using send me a message. I’ll buy it off you.

Deleted.

Filler

Dude I love this idea. I doubt the PAX care if I have a blazer on, but it makes crew life MUCH easier.

Have to agree. The blazer and overcoat aren’t real practical when you move around the country and may not even be able to plan where you’re going. A wind breaker would be great. I’ve thought about trying to find a black Army wind breaker with epaulets. Don’t know if that is still part of the Army uniform and if they’re available or not.

Any thoughts on if the one from Crew Outfitters similar to this would be okay to wear?

You will look like a SkyWest pilot wearing the one from Crew Outfitters.

Does anyone care? Not really.

The officer windbreaker is still a thing with Class B’s and clothing sales sells them for about $100.

https://www.shopmyexchange.com/offic...jacket/1566882

I would love to see a Karbon jacket approved. What we have is bulky and not practical at all.

Would be great.

Like you said. Great idea. It will never happen at Envoy.

Not even a pilot just a lurker on here, but would a solid black fleece work? If so you can find them dirt cheap at Coleman’s Military Surplus in solid black made from Polartec like we use in the military minus the name tape parts. I wear one for my current job and it’s nice and cozy.

This thread is more about "Will I get in trouble if I go out of uniform?" Our manual says we're only allowed to wear twin hill uniform pieces, however the general is, "look professional and you'll likely be left alone." Just a question of do you want to take the risk?

That said, I despise our new overcoat. I like the gestapo jacket. I also liked the zip up jacket twin hill had, the zipper on mine doesn't work anymore.

Take it to a tailor and have a new quality zipper installed. Might cost $25 and whalla new coat you like.

Yeah I was thinking about that as I wrote my post.

[QUOTE=ViperCrosswind;2905024]The AA FOM specifically says the sweater can be worn only under the blazer. Only company approved overcoats are approved.

It also says the sweater has to be navy in color, which makes it a leftover language from pre-TH uniform

Voila!

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